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<blockquote data-quote="Faolyn" data-source="post: 8481164" data-attributes="member: 6915329">Of course there can be. But not when you say &quot;he's fidgeting, which is indicative of lying&quot; and using that across the board. This is why I specifically called out other options, like saying &quot;you've noticed that this person fidgets when they lie.&quot;And now that I think about it, when you say &quot;he's fidgeting, which is indicative of lying,&quot; that's telling me what my player thinks: you're saying that my character views fidgeting as a sign of being a liar.Yes, it's also not good to conflate stammering with lying.But again, this is what people are calling pixel hunting. Most DM's I've played with over the decades are more than willing to use things like fidgeting, stammering, or whatever as character traits, ways to make NPCs stand out and feel more real. You're using them as traits we're supposed to notice and pick up on to determine who is important to the adventure.Some players do. Maybe not at your table, but some do.Easy: One is a player moving OOC to discuss an in-game event with the DM. Another is a player who is acting OOC while still playing in-character. Incredibly different things. I don't know how you don't see that.Easy: you're expecting me to remember something, and if I can't, then my character is out of luck.Tell me, would you let me call for an Insight check out of the blue, if there wasn't anything that I the player could pick out--like a fidget or stammer--as being suspicious? I'm guessing no, because you apparently don't allow your players to call for checks. Would you point it out every time this NPC fidgeted or stammered? &quot;Hey, Faolyn, this guy is acting strangely, hint hint&quot;? Or would you wait for me, the player, to pick up on the hint myself? If it's this, then my character is disadvantaged by your DMing style.No, no they really didn't. Not in this case.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Faolyn, post: 8481164, member: 6915329"] Of course there can be. But not when you say "he's fidgeting, which is indicative of lying" [I]and [/I]using that across the board. This is why I specifically called out other options, like saying "you've noticed that this person fidgets when they lie." And now that I think about it, when you say "he's fidgeting, which is indicative of lying," that's telling me what my player thinks: you're saying that my character views fidgeting as a sign of being a liar. Yes, it's also not good to conflate stammering with lying. But again, this is what people are calling pixel hunting. Most DM's I've played with over the decades are more than willing to use things like fidgeting, stammering, or whatever as character traits, ways to make NPCs stand out and feel more real. [I]You're[/I] using them as traits we're supposed to notice and pick up on to determine who is important to the adventure. Some players do. Maybe not at your table, but some do. Easy: One is a player moving OOC to discuss an in-game event with the DM. Another is a player who is [I]acting [/I]OOC while still playing [I]in-character[/I].[I] Incredibly [/I]different things. I don't know how you don't see that. Easy: you're expecting [I]me [/I]to remember something, and if [I]I [/I]can't, then my character is out of luck. Tell me, would you let me call for an Insight check out of the blue, if there wasn't anything that I the player could pick out--like a fidget or stammer--as being suspicious? I'm guessing no, because you apparently don't allow your players to call for checks. Would you point it out every time this NPC fidgeted or stammered? "Hey, Faolyn, this guy is acting strangely, hint hint"? Or would you wait for me, the player, to pick up on the hint myself? If it's this, then my character is disadvantaged by your DMing style. No, no they really didn't. Not in this case. [/QUOTE]

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