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<blockquote data-quote="Swarmkeeper" data-source="post: 8481215" data-attributes="member: 6921763">I'm not following your logic fully here.&nbsp; The question is:&nbsp; How does the ability check result determine the degree of success by the rules?You seem to be conflating ability scores and ability checks in some way.&nbsp; A high ability score gives a bonus in the form of a modifier.&nbsp; There is also the concept of a proficiency bonus.&nbsp; These modifiers and proficiencies certainly are added to an ability check when appropriate.&nbsp; They do influence the chance to succeed.&nbsp; I fail to see where ability scores determine the degree of the success.&nbsp; I see no obvious connection in the Ability Check section of the rules.&nbsp; This seems to be some leap, perhaps influenced by your participation in prior editions of the game.&nbsp; I honestly am not following your path to &quot;this is a very clear rule&quot; here.Let me approach this another way to see if I understand:A 4th level PC with an 16 Charisma and a proficiency in Persuasion would have a +5 bonus to any CHA(Persuasion) ability checks.&nbsp; I think you are saying this is a pretty persuasive individual and I would agree.&nbsp; They might be roleplayed as having great confidence in social situations.Let's say the DM calls a Charisma ability check and the DC is 18 to persuade a stubborn guard to let the party past.If the player, when asked to roll an ability check, rolls a total of 7 (2 on the die), are you saying this quite persuasive character is now a person who is stumbling over their words?&nbsp; How does this degree of failure jive with the fact that this PC is very persuasive by the virtue of their Charisma score and proficiency as you try to connect in your post above?Isn't this result simply an indication that this guard did not buy the PC's reasoning for getting past?&nbsp; Like in the natural language reading of Ability Checks?&nbsp; In other words, the low roll indicated that the approach by the PC failed.&nbsp; It didn't necessarily mean this socially confident PC suddenly became tongue tied or rude.&nbsp; Or, in your game, is that exactly what it meant?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Swarmkeeper, post: 8481215, member: 6921763"] I'm not following your logic fully here. The question is: How does the ability check result determine the [I]degree[/I] of success by the rules? You seem to be conflating ability scores and ability checks in some way. A high ability score gives a bonus in the form of a modifier. There is also the concept of a proficiency bonus. These modifiers and proficiencies certainly are added to an ability check when appropriate. They do influence the chance to succeed. I fail to see where ability scores determine the [I]degree [/I]of the success. I see no obvious connection in the Ability Check section of the rules. This seems to be some leap, perhaps influenced by your participation in prior editions of the game. I honestly am not following your path to "this is a very clear rule" here. Let me approach this another way to see if I understand: A 4th level PC with an 16 Charisma and a proficiency in Persuasion would have a +5 bonus to any CHA(Persuasion) ability checks. I think you are saying this is a pretty persuasive individual and I would agree. They might be roleplayed as having great confidence in social situations. Let's say the DM calls a Charisma ability check and the DC is 18 to persuade a stubborn guard to let the party past. If the player, when asked to roll an ability check, rolls a total of 7 (2 on the die), are you saying this quite persuasive character is now a person who is stumbling over their words? How does this [I]degree[/I] of failure jive with the fact that this PC is very persuasive by the virtue of their Charisma score and proficiency as you try to connect in your post above? Isn't this result simply an indication that this guard did not buy the PC's reasoning for getting past? Like in the natural language reading of Ability Checks? In other words, the low roll indicated that the approach by the PC failed. It didn't necessarily mean this socially confident PC suddenly became tongue tied or rude. Or, in your game, is that exactly what it meant? [/QUOTE]

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