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<blockquote data-quote="Zoatebix" data-source="post: 1702883" data-attributes="member: 11401">I tried to do some figuring from memory, and came up short...Arg, let me get my copy of v4 and add things up for outsider....05 ability score increases over 20 HD.0766 feats over 20 HD.2 Base attack bonus.15 d8 HD.18 3 good saves (versus .12 for fighter...).092 for 8 skill points per HDThat's .7486 per HD right there!&nbsp; Strange...&nbsp; It really seems like Outsiders are under-valued.&nbsp; Dragons have the same thing except 2 fewer skill points and d12 HD, right?&nbsp; That puts them at .7921!&nbsp; Are monster HD under-valued across the board?&nbsp; They get silver-ruled even lower than that, too (even more with the 2/3rds rule from Grim Tales).Fighters (and other PC classes) do have several things in their favor that usually don't get factored into their CRs, though.&nbsp; This system does assume that creatures have 3 10s and 3 11s for their ability scores.&nbsp; Outsiders have to get increased ability scores, even the standard array (15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8 or whatever).&nbsp; PC characters usually get better scores than average for 'free'.&nbsp; Maybe the inherent advantages of PCs is coded into the system, and further corrected for by the silver rule or the 2/3rds rule.I'm really interested in this now!</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Zoatebix, post: 1702883, member: 11401"] I tried to do some figuring from memory, and came up short ...Arg, let me get my copy of v4 and add things up for outsider... .05 ability score increases over 20 HD .0766 feats over 20 HD .2 Base attack bonus .15 d8 HD .18 3 good saves (versus .12 for fighter...) .092 for 8 skill points per HD That's .7486 per HD right there! Strange... It really seems like Outsiders are under-valued. Dragons have the same thing except 2 fewer skill points and d12 HD, right? That puts them at .7921! Are monster HD under-valued across the board? They get silver-ruled even lower than that, too (even more with the 2/3rds rule from Grim Tales). Fighters (and other PC classes) do have several things in their favor that usually don't get factored into their CRs, though. This system does assume that creatures have 3 10s and 3 11s for their ability scores. Outsiders have to get increased ability scores, even the standard array (15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8 or whatever). PC characters usually get better scores than average for 'free'. Maybe the inherent advantages of PCs is coded into the system, and further corrected for by the silver rule or the 2/3rds rule. I'm really interested in this now! [/QUOTE]

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