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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Tovec" data-source="post: 5749227" data-attributes="member: 95493">My point was that all classes have to spend money on gear.1A. The fighter has to spend money on gear to do his primary thing.1B. That the wizard doesn't. He just casts. Naked.2. If the fighter has to spend 30 k gold to bring up his numbers and the wizard has to spend 0 k in the same measure that it is unfair.3. That the wizard needs more "rings of protection,etc." than the fighter then I highly disagree. ALL classes need these basic protection items. Wizards are the ones who get more gold to spend on them because they get their bigger spells for free vs the fighter who has to pay an exponential rate to copy it - at higher levels. Once again, I never said zero gold while doing a dungeon or any other scenario that follows later. So I'm not going to address those individually.My point was that the wizard can create extra-dimensional spaces, reinforcements or not, to hide out in and the non-casters can't. A wizard can make these extra-dimensional places in addition to throwing fireballs, casting divination (to know what spells to prepare or what to expect later), and any other number of contingency and utility effects. FOR FREE!Yes there are a lot of tactics the party could encounter if the enemy is at the same level and without going into a huge side tangent - the party can become annoyed if the enemy constantly uses their own Wizard related tricks to avoid the fight every time.Sidenote: The whole "reputation" thing only arises if they leave survivors, which is often unlikely, or if they're being watched already.Which is great if the party can perform a valuable function instead of wizard casting scry to see room, wizard teleporting in, wizard nuking whatever is there, wizard teleporting out.If the fighter and rogue came with then they can deal with a couple in the corner.Meanwhile the wizard has dealt with the rest of the room and still be able to use knock on the locked door or teleport through.This is why I try to avoid absurdities and tangents.By smashing them.A wizard can blow them up, trap them, disintegrate them, unlock them, seal them, create a portal in them, etc.See where I'm going with the "multiple options" thing?Right, but the class most likely to be able to handle such tactics against them are OTHER WIZARDS. Not the non-casters. The non-casters have few defenses or contingencies against them. This is what I was saying earlier about the best choice to take out a wizard is another wizard, whereas the best choice to take out any other class is still a wizard.It also has a range of (100+10ft/level) so.. min 110 feet. A fighter or ranger (at best) is going to have to fire a composite longbow, 1d8+STR. In order to require a concentration check the attacker would have to be within melee to provoke an attack of opportunity. Alright, yes, one good hit and the wizard is dead. One failed save and the fighter is dead. About even, sure. Except the fighter has no guarantee to make the WILL SAVE against a practiced wizard on the first try and every guarantee he'll die if he fails. Plus, as I repeatedly state, this is just one spell the wizard has in his array. Others stop the fighter from finding the wizard, getting to the wizard or killing the wizard. All at level 1, all without buying a stick of equipment or spending a single gold piece beyond their spellbook.[MENTION=9287]master arminas[/MENTION]The part you bolded was a statement, not a proof. One asserts something the other shows how it is correct. The statement meant nothing to me and the proof did not persuade me, I re-quoted you in my post to underline how silly your proof had been in my opinion.(Your proof will be what I bold.)As the last few items, as I said, are needed by every character at higher levels they aren't valid proofs. All classes need protective items and benefit from wondrous items.The "staves and wands" can be used by rogues or any with UMD as much as any caster. The caster doesn't NEED to buy the staves and wands because they do have spells. A fighter DOES NEED his weapons and shield. He can't get away with it and still be a fighter. (I'm hedging because I know there are fighter-builds which are similar to monks in that they are unarmoured and weaponless but they aren't the typical fighters.)As for..Making them buy scrolls in order to learn more spells means that they have to find them and it hurts their overall standing (in terms of gold and time) to learn those spells. Certainly with some players that expense will not matter but with many of the players in my area this will be something they don't want to expend their time and money on and they'll have a reduced list because of it.</blockquote>

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