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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Verisimilitude IMPROVEMENTS in 4e
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<blockquote data-quote="Ruin Explorer" data-source="post: 4080529" data-attributes="member: 18"><p>That's a really negative attitude that doesn't seem to be reflective of how most people felt about D&D. If you always had such a viewpoint, though, that explains a lot about things you've said. I always thought D&D had "just about enough" versimilitude, in terms of "simulating" a Heroic Fantasy environment. Not a huge giant amount, but a lot more than 0.</p><p></p><p><strong>ZombieRoboNinja</strong> - Good post.</p><p></p><p>HP - I agree, I find 4E's HP actually MORE believable and "real" than previous iterations, if sliiiiightly too easy to get back. What's less believable, sadly, is the lack of long-term conditions. Maybe they're in the DMG. There's hope.</p><p></p><p>Vancing Spellcasting - Massively agreed. The Wizard seems a lot more like, y'know a WIZARD, rather than some wierd living magical device. Harry Dresden vs Spellbot 3000, I much prefer ol' Harry. I just hope we get plenty of "utility" spells.</p><p></p><p>Min-max wierdness - Hopefully stays true in the final cut, but yeah, at this stage it's looking good.</p><p></p><p>Greatclub Sneak Attack - Well, it was limited in 1E and 2E too (iirc), so this is a return of versimilitude imo. However it's currently negated from full versimilitude value by being limited to specific weapons, some of which make no sense (sling) and where others would make more sense than many on the list (bow).</p><p></p><p>Crazy high-level spells - So long as there are cool, complex rituals to do similar things, then yes, this is an improvement. If Teleport and Resurrection are just gone I will be unamused. Kinda suspect Resurrection is a routine thing at Epic level, which may or may not lack versimilitude.</p><p></p><p>I'll not mention any of the other negative stuff, but yeah, these mostly do help. I think 4E is going to be not dissimilar to 3E overall for "Heroic Fantasy Versimilitude", I just think the designers have gotten a little too psycho-stalkerish towards Combat.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ruin Explorer, post: 4080529, member: 18"] That's a really negative attitude that doesn't seem to be reflective of how most people felt about D&D. If you always had such a viewpoint, though, that explains a lot about things you've said. I always thought D&D had "just about enough" versimilitude, in terms of "simulating" a Heroic Fantasy environment. Not a huge giant amount, but a lot more than 0. [B]ZombieRoboNinja[/B] - Good post. HP - I agree, I find 4E's HP actually MORE believable and "real" than previous iterations, if sliiiiightly too easy to get back. What's less believable, sadly, is the lack of long-term conditions. Maybe they're in the DMG. There's hope. Vancing Spellcasting - Massively agreed. The Wizard seems a lot more like, y'know a WIZARD, rather than some wierd living magical device. Harry Dresden vs Spellbot 3000, I much prefer ol' Harry. I just hope we get plenty of "utility" spells. Min-max wierdness - Hopefully stays true in the final cut, but yeah, at this stage it's looking good. Greatclub Sneak Attack - Well, it was limited in 1E and 2E too (iirc), so this is a return of versimilitude imo. However it's currently negated from full versimilitude value by being limited to specific weapons, some of which make no sense (sling) and where others would make more sense than many on the list (bow). Crazy high-level spells - So long as there are cool, complex rituals to do similar things, then yes, this is an improvement. If Teleport and Resurrection are just gone I will be unamused. Kinda suspect Resurrection is a routine thing at Epic level, which may or may not lack versimilitude. I'll not mention any of the other negative stuff, but yeah, these mostly do help. I think 4E is going to be not dissimilar to 3E overall for "Heroic Fantasy Versimilitude", I just think the designers have gotten a little too psycho-stalkerish towards Combat. [/QUOTE]
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