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<blockquote data-quote="Anubis" data-source="post: 1092578" data-attributes="member: 2358">Since when did &quot;iconic&quot; or &quot;classic&quot; come to mean the same thing as &quot;good&quot;?Mario is a flat character.&nbsp; Yeah he's a classic and all, but AS A CHARACTER, he's extremely weak.&nbsp; In fact, he has no character.&nbsp; His internal storyline is terribly inconsistent, he has no personality, and he's just kiddish.Same goes for Link but to a lesser degree.&nbsp; Link as a character has never been fleshed out as a leading character should.&nbsp; Instead he's just a generic &quot;hero&quot;.&nbsp; He's a good guy there to beat the bad guy, nothing more.&nbsp; No complexity whatsoever.Cloud, on the other hand, although not one of my favorite characters, is head and shoulders above both.&nbsp; Very complex, lots of inner demons, lots of backstory, lots of EVERYTHING.&nbsp; Internal struggles, real emotion.&nbsp; Stuff Mario and Link have never even touched.As for Sephiroth, he's easily one of history's most complex RPG characters.&nbsp; He's not only got the God complex, he also has this weird life/death thing, lots of intelligence and very little speaking, and the badass persona.&nbsp; In addition, he's got more depth than just about any Nintendo character ever made.If it were up to me, Ghaleon from the Lunar series should win it all.&nbsp; I know for a fact, however, that from a literary POV AND a depth POV, Cloud and Sephiroth easily beat Mario and Link.This isn't about &quot;most famous&quot; character, it's about BEST character.&nbsp; Yeah, the best can't win becasue the best wasn't in it.&nbsp; That leaves us with picking the best of the choices we have.&nbsp; That's Cloud and Sephiroth.&nbsp; They may not be as famous and they may not be iconic, but AS CHARACTERS, they are far superior to Mario and Link in every conceivable way.As for a mature character, I mean a character whose value is based on actual valid points of reasoning such as depth and complexity as opposed to &quot;novelty characters&quot; or iconics as you put them.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Anubis, post: 1092578, member: 2358"] Since when did "iconic" or "classic" come to mean the same thing as "good"? Mario is a flat character. Yeah he's a classic and all, but AS A CHARACTER, he's extremely weak. In fact, he has no character. His internal storyline is terribly inconsistent, he has no personality, and he's just kiddish. Same goes for Link but to a lesser degree. Link as a character has never been fleshed out as a leading character should. Instead he's just a generic "hero". He's a good guy there to beat the bad guy, nothing more. No complexity whatsoever. Cloud, on the other hand, although not one of my favorite characters, is head and shoulders above both. Very complex, lots of inner demons, lots of backstory, lots of EVERYTHING. Internal struggles, real emotion. Stuff Mario and Link have never even touched. As for Sephiroth, he's easily one of history's most complex RPG characters. He's not only got the God complex, he also has this weird life/death thing, lots of intelligence and very little speaking, and the badass persona. In addition, he's got more depth than just about any Nintendo character ever made. If it were up to me, Ghaleon from the Lunar series should win it all. I know for a fact, however, that from a literary POV AND a depth POV, Cloud and Sephiroth easily beat Mario and Link. This isn't about "most famous" character, it's about BEST character. Yeah, the best can't win becasue the best wasn't in it. That leaves us with picking the best of the choices we have. That's Cloud and Sephiroth. They may not be as famous and they may not be iconic, but AS CHARACTERS, they are far superior to Mario and Link in every conceivable way. As for a mature character, I mean a character whose value is based on actual valid points of reasoning such as depth and complexity as opposed to "novelty characters" or iconics as you put them. [/QUOTE]

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