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<blockquote data-quote="pming" data-source="post: 6878741" data-attributes="member: 45197">Hiya.&nbsp;I'm always amazed (and a bit confused) when I hear of tables that have players that specifically state &quot;I use the Ready Action&quot;, &quot;I use the Attack Action&quot;, &quot;I use the Dash Action&quot;, etc. To me that sounds exactly like those folks are trying desperately to emulate a turn-based computer game. ... ... ... huh...This phenomenon isn't relegated to just Combat stuff. I hear of tables wherein the players also say things like &quot;I use my Perception skill&quot;, &quot;I'll roll my Diplomacy to get the captain to agree with me&quot;, &quot;I rolled a 17 on Sense Motive, is he lying?&quot;. I find this method of play...perplexing.Maybe I'm in the minority (I hope not!), but how my games play out are by players saying things like &quot;I'll wait to see if the Shield Mater pushes the orc down...and when/if he does, I'll stab the stinky green-skin with my spear!&quot;, &quot;I'll attack the orc with my spear&quot;, or &quot;Hell no! I'll run as fast as I can back down the hall to where the cleric is!&quot;. Or, not in combat, I hear things like &quot;I'll keep an eye out for folks that seem to be eye-balling us...in particular, anyone that looks like an elf&quot;, &quot;I ask the captain if he is adverse to a compromise...I propose that Black Dougal stay here, in custody, while he gives us time to find the true culprit...say, one day? If we don't succeed by then, Black Dougal and the rest of us will throw ourselves at his judgment and mercy&quot;, Or &quot;That doesn't sound anywhere near true. Is he avoiding eye contact or anything? Is he fidgeting and stuff...I don't believe him&quot;.Then, I, as DM, look at the rules of the game and decide if something fits what the player want's his character to do. Then I use those rules as is, modify based on the situation, or ignore them and come up with something on my own. We make some die rolls and play on.So...to the OP... I can't see anything that wouldn't let you &quot;Shove&quot; the guy, and then bash him with your mace (or whatever). I also don't see any reason why the barbarian with a 2-h sword can't just stand next you you/him and wait for the opportunity to also get in on the &quot;smash/stab/slice the guy on the ground&quot; action. I mean, the player doesn't have to &quot;pick&quot; an action. That's not his job. His job is to role-play his character...the DM is there to then apply whatever rule fits best to help tell the story or adjudicate the situation.Is my DM'ing so far out there nowadays? <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f635.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt="o_O" title="Er... what?&nbsp; &nbsp; o_O"&nbsp; data-smilie="12"data-shortname="o_O" /> I mean, back when I was learning to DM (about 1981 I started to DM), sure, I tried to stick &quot;to the rules&quot;...but that only lasted a handful of sessions because most of the time the players were trying to do such crazy and outlandishly heroic (or dastardly!) things that the rules often didn't cover it much at all. Nowadays I can see that some may think that in order to have a character do something, his &quot;choice of action&quot; has to actually be an &quot;Approved Action as Listed in The Book&quot;...because that's what 3e fostered (if there isn't a rule...go buy another book...don't make it up on your own for the love of the gawds!...that's MADNESS!...you aren't a published professional RPG designer...you'll hurt yourself!...don't do it man!...you don't know what you're doing!...&nbsp; <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink&nbsp; &nbsp; ;)"&nbsp; data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> ).Anyway..sorry for the little diversion. I just don't see how anyone could justifiably tell a player &quot;No, you can't wait until he attacks you first&quot; when that's, to me, the equivalent of saying &quot;No, you can't pull the string to pour the bucket of water over the doorway when someone walks into the room&quot;. Same thing in my book.^_^Paul L. Ming</blockquote>

[QUOTE="pming, post: 6878741, member: 45197"] Hiya. I'm always amazed (and a bit confused) when I hear of tables that have players that specifically state "I use the Ready Action", "I use the Attack Action", "I use the Dash Action", etc. To me that sounds [I]exactly[/I] like those folks are trying desperately to emulate a turn-based computer game. ... ... ... huh... This phenomenon isn't relegated to just Combat stuff. I hear of tables wherein the players also say things like "I use my Perception skill", "I'll roll my Diplomacy to get the captain to agree with me", "I rolled a 17 on Sense Motive, is he lying?". I find this method of play...perplexing. Maybe I'm in the minority (I hope not!), but how my games play out are by players saying things like "I'll wait to see if the Shield Mater pushes the orc down...and when/if he does, I'll stab the stinky green-skin with my spear!", "I'll attack the orc with my spear", or "Hell no! I'll run as fast as I can back down the hall to where the cleric is!". Or, not in combat, I hear things like "I'll keep an eye out for folks that seem to be eye-balling us...in particular, anyone that looks like an elf", "I ask the captain if he is adverse to a compromise...I propose that Black Dougal stay here, in custody, while he gives us time to find the true culprit...say, one day? If we don't succeed by then, Black Dougal and the rest of us will throw ourselves at his judgment and mercy", Or "That doesn't sound anywhere near true. Is he avoiding eye contact or anything? Is he fidgeting and stuff...I don't believe him". Then, I, as DM, look at the rules of the game and decide if something fits what the player want's his character to do. Then I use those rules as is, modify based on the situation, or ignore them and come up with something on my own. We make some die rolls and play on. So...to the OP... I can't see anything that wouldn't let you "Shove" the guy, and then bash him with your mace (or whatever). I also don't see any reason why the barbarian with a 2-h sword can't just stand next you you/him and wait for the opportunity to also get in on the "smash/stab/slice the guy on the ground" action. I mean, the player doesn't have to "pick" an action. That's not his job. His job is to role-play his character...the DM is there to then apply whatever rule fits best to help tell the story or adjudicate the situation. Is my DM'ing so far out there nowadays? o_O I mean, back when I was learning to DM (about 1981 I started to DM), sure, I tried to stick "to the rules"...but that only lasted a handful of sessions because most of the time the players were trying to do such crazy and outlandishly heroic (or dastardly!) things that the rules often didn't cover it much at all. Nowadays I can see that some may [I]think[/I] that in order to have a character do something, his "choice of action" has to actually be an "Approved Action as Listed in The Book"...because that's what 3e fostered (if there isn't a rule...go buy another book...don't make it up on your own for the love of the gawds!...[I]that's MADNESS![/I]...you aren't a published professional RPG designer...you'll hurt yourself!...don't do it man!...you don't know what you're doing!... ;) ). Anyway..sorry for the little diversion. I just don't see how anyone could justifiably tell a player "No, you can't wait until he attacks you first" when that's, to me, the equivalent of saying "No, you can't pull the string to pour the bucket of water over the doorway when someone walks into the room". Same thing in my book. ^_^ Paul L. Ming [/QUOTE]

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