D&D 5E Wall of Force / Forcecage House Rules

[kcStranger]

Hi all,

First of all...D&D 5e has a fair number of overpowered/"broken" spells, and as has been pointed out elsewhere, it is that way by design. So in that sense, RAW Wall of Force / Forcecage are functioning as intended. That said, there are those of us who would rather not allow PCs to trap enemies (or vice-versa) without any kind of save or ability to resist. Those people are the ones to whom this post is addressed.

My question to you all is, what house rules for Wall of Force / Forcecage have you used successfully? I've theorycrafted on my own but haven't actually tested anything. I know that there have been several other threads about these spells, but I'm especially interested in any feedback on my specific ideas or that people have actually playtested.

For Wall of Force, here are some ideas I'm kicking around:

1. The wall "snaps" to nearby surfaces, so you can't make a hole in it bigger than a Medium creature could walk through or a Large creature could squeeze through.

2. Allowing a STR check against the wall; on a success, the creature is freed but takes some force damage.

3. Allowing the trapped creature to attack the wall to force a Concentration check on the caster. Without going into details, there would be a damage threshold, and it would probably take multiple successes to break free.

4. Allowing a DEX save a la Wall of Stone.

For Forcecage, I am considering:

1. Allowing a DEX save (perhaps vs DC 20 rather than caster's spell save) to dodge being imprisoned.

2. Specifying that the material component is consumed.

Note my intention is not to make all these (or similar) changes, but just a subset. Thanks for reading!

 

[Searinox Nagharha]

I'd simply allow Dex saves vs the Casters DC.
It kinda represent how fast the caster can conjure up the force to create said effect
VS
The targets reflexes to GTFA from its current location

 

[devincutler]

In Pathfinder, they made Wall of Force have hardness and hit points, so it can be beaten down over time. This is probably the route to go. Give it an AC, lots of hit points, and maybe even resistance to piercing weapons and immunity to poison and psychic damage.

I have always felt WoF was one of the worst balanced spells in the game. It was worse in 3.5 when a sorcerer could spam them all over the battlefield. At least in 5e it requires concentration, so just 1 WoF per caster and can be brought down by damaging the caster.

 

[kcStranger]

After some reflection, I think I may just ban Wall of Force from my games. I haven't come up with a convincing and simple way to balance it while keeping it meaningfully distinct from other spells. There are lots of ways to make it not broken, but at the end of the day I just keep wishing people would take the much better-designed Wall of Stone.

Forcecage can do a lot of the same broken crap, but at least it's L7 and has an expensive material component. Slapping a DEX save on it seems reasonable enough to me.

 

[NotActuallyTim]

Yay! Kill the Force!

Spells. Kill the Force based trapping spells. Don't kill Star Wars, I have too much nostalgia to let that particular series go.

 

[CapnZapp]

Hi all,

First of all...D&D 5e has a fair number of overpowered/"broken" spells, and as has been pointed out elsewhere, it is that way by design. So in that sense, RAW Wall of Force / Forcecage are functioning as intended.

Where has this been pointed out? I would be interested to read any relevant discussion. Thanks

 

[Kalshane]

I haven't seen either in use yet, but I did decide to make the material component of Forcecage consumable in my games, so there's at least some thought given as to whether or not it's worth using in a given instance.

 

[kcStranger]

Honestly, I forget exactly where I saw the comment, though I know it was on this forum. The gist of it was this: 4e was probably the most combat-balanced version of D&D, and although some people really enjoyed it, the majority didn't like it as compared to 3.5/Pathfinder. And it's not like 5e is unrealistic, as sufficiently advanced technology is every bit as devastating as some of the spells in 5e. (Nukes OP; nerf plz.) Lots of people like the simplicity and flexibility of 5e and enjoy doing broken things from time to time, as compared to the more drawn-out and controlled nature of combat in 4e. It's just a matter of preference.

Personally, I fall into the camp that prefers 5e overall, but wants to scale back on "auto-win" spells. Depending on how you interpret the rules, certain spells allow players to win fights that they really shouldn't be able to win. For instance, imagine a ninth-level Bard and Wizard going up against a Death Knight (CR 17). If the Bard and Wizard manage to roll better initiative, or have surprise, or whatever, and the GM doesn't rule that the Death Knight is immune to Heat Metal (he's not resistant or immune to fire damage), then the Bard can cast Heat Metal (on the Death Knight's armor), Wizard casts Wall of Force, both back up beyond 60 feet (the range of the Death Knight's spells), and boom--he dead. I prefer not to allow that sort of stuff, and the spell that makes all that stuff possible is Wall of Force, which is impossible to dodge, and impossible to break out of for many enemies.