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<blockquote data-quote="Todd Roybark" data-source="post: 7964738" data-attributes="member: 6920677">I had the same considerations as your player, when I received an opportunity to play a character, with a group of players new to the hobby.I decided to go with a Dragonmarked House of Shadow Elf as a race, and for a class I chose to be a Cleric of Trickery.Having a 18 Dex, proficiency in Stealth, (often with a bonus 2d4 to Stealth checks),&nbsp; good Perception and proficiency in Thieves Tools, I figured I could fulfill both roles.The second session, another player joined the game with a Rogue character, intending to become an Inquisitive subclass character.Being able to sneak, and picking locks is not all a Rogue does in 5e.My cleric can probably get higher Stealth rolls than Rogue, but without Cunning Action, one cannot really Hide, efficiently&nbsp; in combat.Cunning Action means a Rogue can choose to run like a monk with a bonus action, Hide like a mofo, and Disengage at will.D8 Hit Dice and Uncanny Dodge means a Rogue that chooses not to Disengage or Hide, can tank on the front line...at will.&nbsp; Evasion makes Rogues, survival masters.A Wizard just does not compare.&nbsp; It requires too many spell slots to emulate what a Rogue does, and one can only do it in spurts.&nbsp; The Rogue does it for every encounter.In the case of a Wizard, it will take a village, as Expeditious Retreat and Stoneskin are both Concentration spells.Listen to Ashrym, on this, his posts are certifiably true, in this thread.&nbsp; (as are others).The Rogue may not seem sexy on paper, in play, however, the class is a tactical beast, and great fit for a creative player.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Todd Roybark, post: 7964738, member: 6920677"] I had the same considerations as your player, when I received an opportunity to play a character, with a group of players new to the hobby. I decided to go with a Dragonmarked House of Shadow Elf as a race, and for a class I chose to be a Cleric of Trickery. Having a 18 Dex, proficiency in Stealth, (often with a bonus 2d4 to Stealth checks), good Perception and proficiency in Thieves Tools, I figured I could fulfill both roles. The second session, another player joined the game with a Rogue character, intending to become an Inquisitive subclass character. Being able to sneak, and picking locks is not all a Rogue does in 5e. My cleric can probably get higher Stealth rolls than Rogue, but without Cunning Action, one cannot really Hide, efficiently in combat. Cunning Action means a Rogue can choose to run like a monk with a bonus action, Hide like a mofo, and Disengage at will. D8 Hit Dice and Uncanny Dodge means a Rogue that chooses not to Disengage or Hide, can tank on the front line...at will. Evasion makes Rogues, survival masters. A Wizard just does not compare. It requires too many spell slots to emulate what a Rogue does, and one can only do it in spurts. The Rogue does it for every encounter. In the case of a Wizard, it will take a village, as Expeditious Retreat and Stoneskin are both Concentration spells. Listen to Ashrym, on this, his posts are certifiably true, in this thread. (as are others). The Rogue may not seem sexy on paper, in play, however, the class is a tactical beast, and great fit for a creative player. [/QUOTE]

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