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Message: <blockquote data-quote="kengar" data-source="post: 338710" data-attributes="member: 3230">I suggested reducing hit points, etc. to keep the "Lone Goblin" -as someone called it earlier- as a viable threat. Example: a 2nd level rogue has 2d6 hp w/ no CON bonus. Assume full hp for first and an average roll of 3 for 2nd. That's 9hp total. AC works as per d20 (decreasing chance of hitting v. damage absorption). A goblin with a dagger attacks the rogue and hits. Heck, he rolls a nat 20 and makes his 2nd roll for a critical for 2d4 damage (no STR bonus since it is just a goblin). Average rolls means 5 pts of damage. This is a critical hit, folks; meaning that the dagger really struck home. The rogue still has almost half his hit points and is not even negatively affected by the blow. Even at maximum damage the rogue is still up & fighting, though admittedly, at one HP, he maybe should be thinking of running away. One hit from his shortsword or rapier will very probably take the goblin out. This is as it should be in a "grim" campaign, one good blow usually finishes the fight. But the measly, average HP 2nd level rogue is already getting too tough to be killed by a dagger plunged to the hilt into his back??In WHFRP, it's true that the mechanics are different, as is the definition of a critical hit. However,  it is very -IMHO- unWarhammerish to have someone get stabbed as hard as they can be stabbed with a dagger and not be seriously staggered or DEAD. I know that the same goblin with a larger weapon might have downed the rogue, but that is part of my point. A critical hit with a dagger should be enough to do the job on almost anyone, period.D&D is a "Heroic" fantasy game, and that's fine. This means the characters are supposed to be somewhat "Larger than Life." You can talk all you want about "d20 v. D&D" but the fact is the rules were designed with D&D in mind and the other systems are adaptations from that model. Some do a better job than others. Let's look at a similiar situation in WHFRP.Example: An average equivalent to our 2nd level rogue. Human adventuerer Thief. STR=3 Wounds = 3 Toughness = 2, Leather Armor = 1/0 (meaning over 3 hits of damage gets no DR).A similiar foe with a club does 1d6+3(STR); call it 7 points (average roll). Subtract 2 pts for target's Toughness = 5pts. That takes the thief to -2; critical hit! Assume the right arm was struck, about half the dozen or so possible results involve losing the use of the arm at LEAST for the duration of the fight; if not long-term/permanent maiming. A couple results are even fatal. If you scale HP and weapon damage along more "d20-ish" lines, this type of combat breaks down quickly. Either the same weapon does different damage to different people (which makes no sense), or higher "level" people quickly outpace the dangers of combat. Massive damage would have to be a VERY low threshold (5-6 pts) to approximate this. What's the point of having the extra HP in the first place, then? The massive damage rule is a good one, and when I read WotC's take on it for CoCd20 I thought it was a good idea. But the fact is, in WH, the characters are even more vulnerable than that. If you want to run D&D and/or d20 in the Warhammer setting, go for it. I personally would find it lacking in what makes the Old World so cool, but that's me not you. I also think that to get close to the feel of the setting and the game, there would have to be a LOT of twiddling. Like I say, though, that's just me, YMMV and all that. Do whatever you'll have fun with.</ramble> </rant></blockquote>

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