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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ahnehnois" data-source="post: 6146443" data-attributes="member: 17106">So is a bard's in a D&D context. And perhaps others. The point is that there is a supernatural component, even if it is presented in a subtle, naturalistic way.I always did, though it seems ambiguous to me. It's also pretty clear that Saruman and Grima's actions were intertwined.Clearly, LotR magic is not well represented by the Vancian model. It is not manifested in terms of discrete spells, and its effects may be more subtle and subjective. However, I think it's abundantly clear that even a very skilled human could not do the things he does.I'm pretty much in agreement with that. I like a variety of different basic approaches to natural healing and damage to cover the variety of functions one might want in an rpg. I vary pace tremendously just in my own games, and I imagine others do too.In general I think those types of things are clearly conditions, rather than damage. Psychic damage (in pre-4e D&D anyway) often comes with those sorts of conditions.Nonmagical condition recovery (as opposed to hp recovery) is a topic that hasn't been broached in this thread, but is interesting.They do, however, correlate to some type of harm. Nonphysical harm often lasts longer than physical harm.No, but the distinction I was keying on is that leadership/inspiration is generally not the prime requisite from day one of any archetypical character, though it is often a secondary aspect or something that develops over time. Regardless of whether you look at it as a career or a path, a class is something that a character starts in his late teens or early twenties (or equivalent for nonhumans).There are certainly fictional barbarians, for example, who might fit the common-language definition of a warlord, but would clearly be of the barbarian class. The Eye of Gruumsh prestige class is one obvious example. Or in real-world terms, there are certainly military officers who are inspirational leaders or great tacticians, but they are still soldiers first. I'm not against leadership, and I tend to think that game rules overemphasize the physical at the expense of the mental. But I still don't see that a base class does any good.</blockquote>

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