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<blockquote data-quote="ExploderWizard" data-source="post: 5041927" data-attributes="member: 66434">How was one to gather the real point of your complaint from &quot; The Assassination Table&quot;? <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f615.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":confused:" title="Confused&nbsp; &nbsp; :confused:"&nbsp; data-smilie="5"data-shortname=":confused:" />&nbsp;A suggestion is just that. Page 42 of the 4E DMG is just a table which is a suggestion for handling the mechanical effects of stunts. &nbsp;&nbsp;I will try and keep that in mind the next time we plan our foray into the frozen tomb of incorporeal undead horror. Then again I would hate having to explain that the reason I cast sleep at the wraith was that magic missile wasn't worth the spell slot. &nbsp;&nbsp;Silly but effective. Getting an armored fighter to ditch plate mid conflict seems fairly worthwhile to me. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin&nbsp; &nbsp; :D"&nbsp; data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" />&nbsp;That was just off the top of my head. Other spells have thier uses. The light spell had great utility because it could be used as a light source or an effective offensive spell. &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;I never said the niche was a very good one, or that I cared for it. &nbsp;&nbsp;Shields added to any armor changes the game. Also, the modifier to the hit roll did not represent only the pierce or punch factor just as an attack roll did not represent a single swing of a weapon. The modifier was intended to represent the overall effectiveness of a given weapon against an opponent equipped with the listed gear. If it was only about the pure punch factor than every weapon would have massive bonuses against unarmored opponents. &nbsp;&nbsp;I'll take the division of a d8 roll by 3 any day over managing the powers for a paragon tier single classed character. Talk about cumbersome!&nbsp;&nbsp;The avenger is a 4E melee fighter limited to cloth armor. Are they useless? &nbsp;&nbsp;Arbitrary and weird? Quite possibly. &nbsp;&nbsp;AD&amp;D &quot;to hit&quot; adjustments generally modified the AC of the target rather than the raw die roll of the attacker. The repeating 20 kept a certain range of AC's from becoming hit proof. &nbsp;Lets match hit probilities mapping AD&amp;D to the much more intuitive ascending AC system:&nbsp;1E AC&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Target Number 3&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 17 2&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 18 1&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 19 0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 20 -1&nbsp; &nbsp; 20 -2&nbsp; &nbsp; 20 -3&nbsp; &nbsp; 20 -4&nbsp; &nbsp; 20 -5&nbsp; &nbsp; 20 &nbsp;4EAC&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Target Number17&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1718&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1819&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1920&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 2021&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; FATAL EXCEPTION22&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; FATAL EXCEPTION23&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; FATAL EXCEPTION24&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; FATAL EXCEPTION25&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; FATAL EXCEPTION</blockquote>

[QUOTE="ExploderWizard, post: 5041927, member: 66434"] How was one to gather the real point of your complaint from " The Assassination Table"? :confused: A suggestion is just that. Page 42 of the 4E DMG is just a table which is a [I]suggestion [/I]for handling the mechanical effects of stunts. I will try and keep that in mind the next time we plan our foray into the frozen tomb of incorporeal undead horror. Then again I would hate having to explain that the reason I cast sleep at the wraith was that magic missile wasn't worth the spell slot. Silly but effective. Getting an armored fighter to ditch plate mid conflict seems fairly worthwhile to me. :D That was just off the top of my head. Other spells have thier uses. The [I]light [/I]spell had great utility because it could be used as a light source or an effective offensive spell. I never said the niche was a very good one, or that I cared for it. Shields added to any armor changes the game. Also, the modifier to the hit roll did not represent only the pierce or punch factor just as an attack roll did not represent a single swing of a weapon. The modifier was intended to represent the overall effectiveness of a given weapon against an opponent equipped with the listed gear. If it was only about the pure punch factor than every weapon would have massive bonuses against unarmored opponents. I'll take the division of a d8 roll by 3 any day over managing the powers for a paragon tier single classed character. Talk about cumbersome! The avenger is a 4E melee fighter limited to cloth armor. Are they useless? Arbitrary and weird? Quite possibly. AD&D "to hit" adjustments generally modified the AC of the target rather than the raw die roll of the attacker. The repeating 20 kept a certain range of AC's from becoming hit proof. Lets match hit probilities mapping AD&D to the much more intuitive ascending AC system: 1E [B]AC Target Number [/B] 3 17 2 18 1 19 0 20 -1 20 -2 20 -3 20 -4 20 -5 20 4E [B]AC Target Number[/B] 17 17 18 18 19 19 20 20 21 FATAL EXCEPTION 22 FATAL EXCEPTION 23 FATAL EXCEPTION 24 FATAL EXCEPTION 25 FATAL EXCEPTION [/QUOTE]

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