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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Jester David" data-source="post: 6843156" data-attributes="member: 37579">That's equating all things of a class because they're a class. Which is overly simplistic. You don't need to explain "human" as much as "dragonborn" despite both being races, because everyone knows what the former is. You don't need to explain "kicking up a sword into your hand" because it's self explanatory, but you do need to explain how a spell is cast. Similarly, everything a fighter can do doesn't need to be as defined as what a wizard can do. That's total BS. Batman and Superman are both fantastic characters. Ditto Thor and Captain America. But I hold Cap and Batman to very different standards than Thor and Superman despite both being part of the same genre. If I'm reading a comic or watching a movie and Batman lifts a car that's going to take me out of the moment because, as cool as Batman is, he shouldn't be able to lift a car. Even though he's in a comic book universe and sharing a panel with a Kryptonian god. Okay, Batman can push the limits. There's some give and Batman can do things that wouldn't fly on Mythbusters. But there's a line where things just move from incredible to implausible. Fighters *need* to be limited by reality, because we all know what reality is. And once they stop being bound to reality then they become magical. It doesn't matter if it's called a "manuever" or a "talent" or an "exploit" or a "ki power" if it does something superhuman it's freakin' magic. Like Book of the Nine Swords. Sure, lots of them were presented as mundane and flavoured as raw talent... but they were still magic. I disagree. I don't want might fighters doing Wuxia things or I'd play a Wuxia game. The heroic nature of D&D characters varies from edition to edition and level to level. And D&D has almost always been a flexible that has been molded into a variety of campaigns and tones. 5e has shifted characters a little down the power level, and they're not nearly as heroic any more. Even spellcasters at low levels. A Wuxia rules option is different and could work. As could something designed to just make martials better in a high power, low magic campaign (like a 5e update of Iron Heroes). But it's probably not a good baseline.Nope. You totally don't. If only because there's no way to define all the potential actions a player might attempt in combat. What you describe is a rule heavy system then. They exist. If I want one I'd play one.  The alternative is rules lite, where NOTHING is defined. Those exist and are fun too, and work just fine. If I want one of those, I'd also play one.This is a 5e forum. We're discussing 5e. It isn't a rule heavy system. But neither is it a narrative game. It's in the middle. And so it explicitly doesn't need to define every potential action. It was designed for rulings not rules. The best design space IMHO is maneuvers, because you can make the option better. You're not just kicking up a sword, but doing so and making an attack that deals extra damage. So it's not taking things away from anyone but making you better at a specific task.However, when you get into that design, it's something that's probably too good to do at-will.</blockquote>

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