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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Crashy75" data-source="post: 4451548" data-attributes="member: 11017">To make it closer, you'd have to make it 1d2 damage per die of damage received.  But then, it is much easier to deal damage than it is to heal, so you can't really make a clear comparison.  I think it is possible to make some assumptions.  First of all, I think it is reasonable to assume that the DM is throwing a mix of monsters at the party.  This is pretty much an assumption that must be made for any sort of analysis.  Also, defenders do affect the dm's choices on who the npc can attack.  The mark effectively gives a heavy shield to everybody else(or an additional one if they already have one) and the Challenge abilities give the enemy other reasons to attack the defender.  Therefore, it is reasonable to assume that the monster's choice problem is mitigated, at least a bit, when you are talking about defenders.  Going back to the 20 attack model, one is tempted to compare the average damage that a monster could do x2 and compare with the average extra damage done over 20 attacks, but this is probably not an accurate comparison.  It is likely that you will be attacked 20 times before you can make 20 attacks, especially if you are a defender.  Also, another thing that is hard to guage is that the extra damage from 2-handed weapons should have an affect on the damage you receive because, simply, if you take a monster down quicker, he'll make less attacks (vs. you and your party).  Now, perhaps these two cancel each other out, but how can one be sure.  I'm really tempted to create another formula here...(Oh CrazyDwarf, to answer your earlier questions, really both the affects of an ac penalty and damage bonus will vary.  Just as you might roll poor damage with your big great axe, your DM could roll poorly (or really well) with his d20 and your big shield means nothing (the dm never misses you by 2 or less).  This is why we can only really use averages, for the most part.  You could hit 20 out of 20 times and effectively double your damage from using your 2 hander or hit 0 out of 20 negating it completely.  These two possibilities basically cancel each other out.  One think to keep in mind (and one of the reasons I like to go with a 20 attack model) is that, over time, the averages will pan out.  I'd suggest you do that experiment Alex suggested.  You could just set up a random encounter and control all creatures for a mock combat just to see.)</blockquote>

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