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<blockquote data-quote="Water Bob" data-source="post: 5670236" data-attributes="member: 92305">If they're quicker to strike, sure.&nbsp;And, that's what the Speed Factor rule implements.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;That's right. So, his conclusion that using speed factors aren't worth the effort is bogus since he's not considering the full picture.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;I left off a lot of weapons. I presented those that were written in the rule.&nbsp;A GM would have to place weapons that aren't on the list, of course, into one of the three categories. He can look at those weapons in the three categories and then place like weapons that aren't on the list. He can use his own judgement/method. And, he can even take hints from previous D&amp;D games where SF was used (AD&amp;D 1st and 2nd).&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Nope. Since it applies to everyone equally, it will effect everyone equally.&nbsp;I didn't run any numbers when I decided to use the Active Defense optional rule, either.&nbsp;You know what? I didn't run any numbers for the offical rules, either.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;I didn't create the list.&nbsp;Any GM with a problem is free to either not use the system or change a weapon's category--or even add more categories...whatever.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Simple. The first attack has no modifier. Each successive attack does have a modifier.&nbsp;The dagger throw, dagger throw, axe throw is impossible with a +9 BAB character, just as it is for a 9th level Fighter.&nbsp;This character would be BAB +9/+5&nbsp;That's +9 for the first dagger throw and +5 for the second.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;A 10th level character could do it....BAB +10/+6/+1.&nbsp;Easy cheesy.&nbsp;Just take your BAB and subtract the SF (which is easy because there's only three Speed Factors).&nbsp;The system would be more complicated if each weapon had an individual SF. But, with three categories, it's a no brainer.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Let me mix it up for you. A 9th level fighter throws a dagger (Fast) then throws a throwing axe (Standard). That's BAB +9/+4.&nbsp;Throw the throwing axe first, and it becomes BAB +9/+5.&nbsp;I know you're going to ask &quot;Why&quot;, and I'll answer, &quot;I dunno. It's a simplification we accept when accepting the rule, not unlike accepting the fact that 10 hit points of damage can kill one person (a 1st level character)&nbsp; but barely scratching another (a 10th level character).</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Water Bob, post: 5670236, member: 92305"] If they're quicker to strike, sure. And, that's what the Speed Factor rule implements. That's right. So, his conclusion that using speed factors aren't worth the effort is bogus since he's not considering the full picture. I left off a lot of weapons. I presented those that were written in the rule. A GM would have to place weapons that aren't on the list, of course, into one of the three categories. He can look at those weapons in the three categories and then place like weapons that aren't on the list. He can use his own judgement/method. And, he can even take hints from previous D&D games where SF was used (AD&D 1st and 2nd). Nope. Since it applies to everyone equally, it will effect everyone equally. I didn't run any numbers when I decided to use the Active Defense optional rule, either. You know what? I didn't run any numbers for the offical rules, either. I didn't create the list. Any GM with a problem is free to either not use the system or change a weapon's category--or even add more categories...whatever. Simple. The first attack has no modifier. Each successive attack does have a modifier. The dagger throw, dagger throw, axe throw is impossible with a +9 BAB character, just as it is for a 9th level Fighter. This character would be BAB +9/+5 That's +9 for the first dagger throw and +5 for the second. A 10th level character could do it....BAB +10/+6/+1. Easy cheesy. Just take your BAB and subtract the SF (which is easy because there's only three Speed Factors). The system would be more complicated if each weapon had an individual SF. But, with three categories, it's a no brainer. Let me mix it up for you. A 9th level fighter throws a dagger (Fast) then throws a throwing axe (Standard). That's BAB +9/+4. Throw the throwing axe first, and it becomes BAB +9/+5. I know you're going to ask "Why", and I'll answer, "I dunno. It's a simplification we accept when accepting the rule, not unlike accepting the fact that 10 hit points of damage can kill one person (a 1st level character) but barely scratching another (a 10th level character). [/QUOTE]

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