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<blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 6012799" data-attributes="member: 82106">This is exaggeration. PCs will be using their powers, the movement rules, etc all the time, so those things cannot be attached to the rules cost of a specific scenario. It would be just like insisting that we bring in the entire complexity of the equivalent 3e subsystems, possible spells that might be used, items, etc. The 4e rules are far more regular and structured in a way that is simple to remember and apply as well, trust me they're a LOT less obtuse than 3.5 ever dreamed of being.What 4e brings to the table here is a way of quickly and easily assessing improvised moves (on one page of the DMG, very easy to look up and use) and a list of about a dozen conditions, and the action economy/turn structure. The resulting system when used in play is VERY easy to adjudicate. On top of that there is a whole terrain powers concept that lets you easily bake the most likely stuff into the scenario ahead of time, which is especially effective for things like modules where someone else will likely run it. It isn't any ONE thing about 4e that makes it work so well. It is the incremental effect of their strict adherence to a structured system with very simple straightforward and usually minimalistic core elements like keywords, damage types, and conditions. Any time you run into anything in 4e it works very similarly mechanics-wise to doing another thing in a different situation. It just makes things fast and easy. The players are very rarely confused by it and the logic is highly transparent. Even without talking to the DM most reasonably experienced players can make a solid guess as to what the effect of dropping a chandelier or rolling logs down a hill, or whatever is likely to have.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="AbdulAlhazred, post: 6012799, member: 82106"] This is exaggeration. PCs will be using their powers, the movement rules, etc all the time, so those things cannot be attached to the rules cost of a specific scenario. It would be just like insisting that we bring in the entire complexity of the equivalent 3e subsystems, possible spells that might be used, items, etc. The 4e rules are far more regular and structured in a way that is simple to remember and apply as well, trust me they're a LOT less obtuse than 3.5 ever dreamed of being. What 4e brings to the table here is a way of quickly and easily assessing improvised moves (on one page of the DMG, very easy to look up and use) and a list of about a dozen conditions, and the action economy/turn structure. The resulting system when used in play is VERY easy to adjudicate. On top of that there is a whole terrain powers concept that lets you easily bake the most likely stuff into the scenario ahead of time, which is especially effective for things like modules where someone else will likely run it. It isn't any ONE thing about 4e that makes it work so well. It is the incremental effect of their strict adherence to a structured system with very simple straightforward and usually minimalistic core elements like keywords, damage types, and conditions. Any time you run into anything in 4e it works very similarly mechanics-wise to doing another thing in a different situation. It just makes things fast and easy. The players are very rarely confused by it and the logic is highly transparent. Even without talking to the DM most reasonably experienced players can make a solid guess as to what the effect of dropping a chandelier or rolling logs down a hill, or whatever is likely to have. [/QUOTE]

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