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What are the Roles now?
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<blockquote data-quote="Sacrosanct" data-source="post: 6503683" data-attributes="member: 15700"><p>Yes. It was. Especially the AD&D dragon magazine version. I guess I don't place the entire worth of a class on how well it beats the challenges mechanically compared to every other class. I think the flavor it adds to the game is worth a whole lot. I'm getting the vibe you don't.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>ah, goal post shifting. That's not what you said. I said they weren't the same, and you replied "tomato tomahto", implying you didn't see any difference. Nothing about concept until just now. Which, by the way, the concept isn't the same either. An occupation, and a role, are two totally different things. Even in concept.</p><p></p><p></p><p>So if a class can't do <em>every</em> role, that means it can't do more than <em>one</em> role? Because otherwise I don't see how you are disproving my point at all with this very specific example. I can have a cleric in 1e act as a healer, tank, defender, striker, leader, controller, etc. The point is that in earlier D&D, you weren't explicitly <strong>told</strong> you had to follow a certain role if you chose a class, which you in fact told in 4e. Can't help but notice you left that part out in your quote to me.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Well, cease with the strawman for one. Unless you can show a post of mine saying that. I never said you can do whatever class and do whatever you like. A fighter can't cast spells after all. But a fighter <em>can</em> attempt to do things like lead (using CHA), disarm traps, etc. Maybe not as skilled as a thief, but that doesn't mean he can't try to do it. Which is our point we have been trying to make. Just because you chose a particular class, doesn't mean you're locked into a specific role <em>all the time</em>. What part of "role-playing" is foreign to you? Or are you one of those guys who thinks PCs can't do anything unless it's expressly spelled out on a character sheet?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Sacrosanct, post: 6503683, member: 15700"] Yes. It was. Especially the AD&D dragon magazine version. I guess I don't place the entire worth of a class on how well it beats the challenges mechanically compared to every other class. I think the flavor it adds to the game is worth a whole lot. I'm getting the vibe you don't. ah, goal post shifting. That's not what you said. I said they weren't the same, and you replied "tomato tomahto", implying you didn't see any difference. Nothing about concept until just now. Which, by the way, the concept isn't the same either. An occupation, and a role, are two totally different things. Even in concept. So if a class can't do [i]every[/i] role, that means it can't do more than [i]one[/i] role? Because otherwise I don't see how you are disproving my point at all with this very specific example. I can have a cleric in 1e act as a healer, tank, defender, striker, leader, controller, etc. The point is that in earlier D&D, you weren't explicitly [b]told[/b] you had to follow a certain role if you chose a class, which you in fact told in 4e. Can't help but notice you left that part out in your quote to me. Well, cease with the strawman for one. Unless you can show a post of mine saying that. I never said you can do whatever class and do whatever you like. A fighter can't cast spells after all. But a fighter [i]can[/i] attempt to do things like lead (using CHA), disarm traps, etc. Maybe not as skilled as a thief, but that doesn't mean he can't try to do it. Which is our point we have been trying to make. Just because you chose a particular class, doesn't mean you're locked into a specific role [i]all the time[/i]. What part of "role-playing" is foreign to you? Or are you one of those guys who thinks PCs can't do anything unless it's expressly spelled out on a character sheet? [/QUOTE]
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