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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Nergal Pendragon" data-source="post: 6505147" data-attributes="member: 6777649">I never knew a barbarian who would play with less than 18 at start, and quite a few liked to use racials to bump it up to 20. Having such a big hit die generally meant you could afford to not invest as much into Constitution.I never seen a rogue manage to use stealth attacks anywhere near the frequency that barbarians raged, and most of the people I talked with said it really wasn't something that came up often. While it was theoretically possible, in actual play they found the right combat scenario didn't come up much.This is a trap tactic. Most recorded rogue deaths seen in any group I ever talked to or played with from attempting sneak attacks were from attempting to flank. The low health die rogues have, light armor they have to wear to be anything close to effective at their class skills, and the existence of the Attack of Opportunity generally spelled rogue death if they ever tried to flank. And that's assuming they were in a combat scenario where flanking was even a viable possibility.The number of times per day and the stat bonuses from rage both increased. And for most groups, five times per day covered the entire adventuring day as far as combat went.Most dedicated rogues built their characters as trapfinders and skill monkeys. Basically, the strength of the class as they played it laid entirely outside of combat. A lot of rogues multi-classed or focused on prestige classes.Which is why I am very glad to see such a design did not make it into 5E.</blockquote>

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