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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Imaro" data-source="post: 6532653" data-attributes="member: 48965">Again I'm wondering have you read the corebooks or actually played 5e?  Serious question, what is the extent of your experience with 5e?Uhm no... first they are maneuvers not powers and second all Battle Masters get a total of 9 by 15th level... so no BattleMaster has 16 or 12 maneuvers...  Melee weapons being more effective how?  Pure damage dealing?  Only if you go two-handed, which means...1. You can't be a small race or you suffer disadvantage on attacks2. You aren't wearing a shield3. You can only ever use ranged combat effectively within 30ft (Str based) without suffering disadvantage to attacks.4. You must engage foes in melee to attack thus you are being attacked in return and are open to AoO5. Can't use stealth while fighting As to your other points... they don't make any sense.   You don't have to spend feats to be effective in ranged combat, though you should if that's what you want to focus on.  the range on a longbow (without disadvantage on attacks) is 150ft...  Most melee combatants can't even reach you before you've gotten multiple attacks off... You can also move and hide as a ranged combatant after attacking (since we're assuming cover is common enough to pose penalties in enough fights that a feat is needed to compensate <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f615.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":confused:" title="Confused    :confused:"  data-smilie="5"data-shortname=":confused:" /> ).  Of course I'm not understanding how exactly they would get to the archer if they stay under cover?  He'd just continue to shoot at them with the penalties until the law of averages allowed him to kill them... same with an opponent engaged with your ally, it's a free attack where you're not suffering an attack in return or an AoO.  I think in your effort to vastly simplify "effective" you've totally glossed over the actual advantages of ranged combat...    The same amount of powers...ability to snipe, stealth and surprise from up to 150ft away, higher average initiative,  no feats are necessary, suffers less direct attacks and AoO (so no need for an AC that is as high as a meatshield)... so yeah I'd say just as effective if not more since they can also melee with finesse weapons while using a shield if necessary.  Of course if you had read the fighter section or even the character boards on the WotC forums you'd already know most of this.  In fact if it wasn't for the damage disparity there would literally be no reason to ever play a strength fighter... Except for the 9 maneuvers a Battle Master can use with a ranged weapon... or the improved crits a champion gets with it... or the spells an EK can use to enhance his ranged attacks... so yeah just like 4e. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f615.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":confused:" title="Confused    :confused:"  data-smilie="5"data-shortname=":confused:" /> How does an archer fighter get hit more attacking from 150ft away against targets that are continuously keeping cover?  Now you're really just showing your ignorance of the system.  Also just an FYI... sharpshooter is a single feat that not only negates all those penalties for cover, increases my effective range to 600ft but also allows me to take a -5 to hit in order to increase my damage by 10 (and don't forget I already get a +2 with ranged weapons from archery style)... but yeah you keep laughing from 600ft away...It's under damage rolls in the combat section of the PHB... <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/erm.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":erm:" title="Erm    :erm:" data-shortname=":erm:" /></blockquote>

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