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Message: <blockquote data-quote="comrade raoul" data-source="post: 299974" data-attributes="member: 554">Better BAB Stacking For Multiclass MonksI'd add use the OA monk, like others have suggested, and also use a new system (proposed below) for determining the base attack progression of multiclassed monks. When a multiclassed monk fights unarmed or with a special monk weapon (basically, any time she takes advantage of her improved attack rate), she may, to a limited extent, use the combined base attack bonuses from her monk and her non-monk classes with her improved attack rate, according to the following system. <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">If the character has as many, or more, levels in her monk class as she has total levels in her other classes, she combines her base attack bonuses from all of her classes and gains additional attacks based on the total, according to the monk's accelerated (-3 interval) progression. Except for the better attack rate, this is just like the normal system for determining additional attacks for multiclassed characters.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">If she has more levels in her other classes than she has in the monk class, she may either (a) make additional attacks according to the normal (-5 interval) progression; or (b) combine her base attack bonuses from her monk levels and a number of levels in other classes equal to her monk levels (the monk uses the combination of levels that yields the best possible attack bonus, if multiple combinations are possible), and determine her additional attacks according to that total.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Important caveat: Multiclassed monks with a base attack bonus greater than +15 may never have more than five iterative unarmed attacks per round. For example, a multiclassed monk with a base attack bonus of +16 (a monk 10/fighter 9, say), attacks at +16/+13/+10/+7/+4. (They can have more attacks, of course, but only through other means, like haste or flurry of blows.)</li> </ul>This might sound more complicated than it is, and can be best cleared up with an example. Suppose Hari Zel'dan ("The Prescient") is a human monk 4/wizard (diviner) 4. His total levels in other classes do not exceed his monk levels, so he combines base attack bonuses from his monk and wizard levels when determining his unarmed attack rate -- thus he gets two unarmed attacks, at +5/+2. But then suppose he gains his next two levels as a fighter, becoming a monk 4/wizard 4/fighter 2. He can either uses his total attack bonus from all ten levels at the normal -5 rate (for +7/+2), or he can combine his monk levels and his "best" four other levels (here fighter 2/wizard 2) for a total unarmed attack bonus of +6, yielding two attacks at +6/+3.This method of calculating improved unarmed attacks seems to me to substantially increase the versatility of monks by allowing them to multiclass with much less trouble or worry. Previously, it seemd to me that monks couldn't really multiclass to any real extent -- it could do serious harm to their unarmed attack progression. Thus, monks were railroaded into playing single-classed characters to a much greater extent than anyone else. But allowing free, unlimited unarmed attack bonus stacking (as Sean Reynolds has suggested) struck me as even more problematic, since one level of monk would get you set for life whenever you attacked unarmed or with a special monk weapon. So a limited stacking system seemed appropriate. This one, I think, captures the best of both worlds: it allows monks to multiclass effectively, but prevents abusive combinations.And finally, I think you could get some very fun characters this way. A wizard/monk or sorcerer/monk could represent something like an exotic Eastern mystic who combined arcane power with martial arts; cleric/monks or druid/monks would be uniquely contemplative and spiritual; rogue/monks would look a lot like ninjas; and fighter/monks would be terrific, classic martial artists (monks with levels in other classes seem less archetypical but still potentially fun and interesting). So yes, a monk with a friendlier multiclassing system suddenly looks substantially more versatile and flavorful.P.S. Note that I was at first worried about the fighter/monk's attack rate (and the same applies for monks who multiclass as other classes with good BAB progressions), but I don't think it's really a problem -- with an optimal multiclass combination, they get iterative attacks faster than anyone else (at 5th, 8th, 12th, and 15th levels), generally one to three levels earlier than monks. But they've got to do so with all of the normal limitations and a slower rate of unarmed damage and unarmored AC growth.[Edit]: This system would be even cooler with the addition of some new feats geared towards multiclassed monks. A version of the "Monk Weapon" feat (that allowed monks to get their favorable attack rate and flurry abilities with other weapons) posted earlier would work fine (you'd get kensai-like fighter/monks), as would more exotic feats, like feats that allowed monks to gain mystic tatoos that allowed them to use their bodies (and, thus, unarmed strikes) like spell-storing weapons, or "vital-point" maneuvers that combined Stunning Fist or similar abilities with sneak attacks. I'll post complete versions of these feats before long.</blockquote>

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