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*Pathfinder & Starfinder
What Classes are Missing?
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<blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 5090068" data-attributes="member: 82106"><p>It pretty much feels like a description of the wizard to me. Yes, a lot of people try to make damage dealing wizards, but the best ones by far are really exactly this sort of build. The guy that makes an area too slippery to cross, tangled in webs, icy, filled with poison gas, blocked by a wall of magical ice, etc.</p><p></p><p>Not that there couldn't be a different class which uses different flavor to do the same thing, but I'd want to see it have some unique mechanical differences. </p><p></p><p>One thing that often is neglected in these debates is aspects of the class outside of pure combat. I find it a negative feature of a lot of proposed class designs that its hard to think of good non-combat utilities and such for them that are really distinctive. Class design shouldn't focus totally on combat aspects of the class, though obviously that's going to be a very significant dimension.</p><p></p><p>I'm really still not picturing a class that focuses on being mounted. It definitely has quite a lot of OOC stuff going for it, but then is that really very distinct from what other characters can already do simply by having an ordinary mount? In combat the problem is just that situations where being mounted is really a credible advantage are tough to find when you look at the typical party. Its certainly possible to have 'mount powers' or 'mount power rider effects' etc. That provides a mechanical basis when combined with a mount class feature. The question is will it fit well in most games or not? If its not a fairly minor feature of the class its going to create some problems. As a fairly minor feature it almost seems better relegated to a build choice in one of the existing classes.</p><p></p><p>I think a lot of things like melee controller and ranged defender are just hard to distinguish from other existing classes and roles. They have also been nibbled around the edges a good bit already at best. A ranged defender is already a pretty good description of a swordmage for instance, even if it isn't always exactly that. Melee controller IMHO pretty accurately describes a fighter too. Sure they're called defenders, but they could as easily have been called melee controllers. Not that new and distinctive classes are impossible that might use these role designations but I'm still looking for one that's really compelling.</p><p></p><p>Maybe I'm just in the camp that feels like 'less is more' when it comes to classes. I'd rather see new builds than whole new classes.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="AbdulAlhazred, post: 5090068, member: 82106"] It pretty much feels like a description of the wizard to me. Yes, a lot of people try to make damage dealing wizards, but the best ones by far are really exactly this sort of build. The guy that makes an area too slippery to cross, tangled in webs, icy, filled with poison gas, blocked by a wall of magical ice, etc. Not that there couldn't be a different class which uses different flavor to do the same thing, but I'd want to see it have some unique mechanical differences. One thing that often is neglected in these debates is aspects of the class outside of pure combat. I find it a negative feature of a lot of proposed class designs that its hard to think of good non-combat utilities and such for them that are really distinctive. Class design shouldn't focus totally on combat aspects of the class, though obviously that's going to be a very significant dimension. I'm really still not picturing a class that focuses on being mounted. It definitely has quite a lot of OOC stuff going for it, but then is that really very distinct from what other characters can already do simply by having an ordinary mount? In combat the problem is just that situations where being mounted is really a credible advantage are tough to find when you look at the typical party. Its certainly possible to have 'mount powers' or 'mount power rider effects' etc. That provides a mechanical basis when combined with a mount class feature. The question is will it fit well in most games or not? If its not a fairly minor feature of the class its going to create some problems. As a fairly minor feature it almost seems better relegated to a build choice in one of the existing classes. I think a lot of things like melee controller and ranged defender are just hard to distinguish from other existing classes and roles. They have also been nibbled around the edges a good bit already at best. A ranged defender is already a pretty good description of a swordmage for instance, even if it isn't always exactly that. Melee controller IMHO pretty accurately describes a fighter too. Sure they're called defenders, but they could as easily have been called melee controllers. Not that new and distinctive classes are impossible that might use these role designations but I'm still looking for one that's really compelling. Maybe I'm just in the camp that feels like 'less is more' when it comes to classes. I'd rather see new builds than whole new classes. [/QUOTE]
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