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<blockquote data-quote="Mustrum_Ridcully" data-source="post: 4553898" data-attributes="member: 710">Ah, well, I can live with that. But who cares about me?&nbsp; <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink&nbsp; &nbsp; ;)"&nbsp; data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />For D&amp;D, perhaps. But I mentioned Torg, and I somehow like Torgs approach more. Though it also has its drawbacks, I suppose. Possibilities are plot protection &amp; moxie points. Damage is dealt as shock and as wounds - you just can spend your Possibilities to negate that damage. Basically it feels like it creates a &quot;realistic&quot; world and then adds the plot protection on. Maybe this is actually too complicated or to convoluted? Or maybe this is just brilliant for any fan of &quot;realismn&quot; or &quot;versimilitude&quot;, because he understands &quot;this is what would happen in the real world, but we don't let it happen!&quot; While hit points confuse and conceal the issue.EDIT: I had meant to mention this and forgot. I like the fact that there are effects-- poison, save or die-- that can kill you &quot;suddenly.&quot; But that is not to say that the risk should be completely unanticipated. In terms of plot protection, it matters that the players know when they are at significant risk. It helps to build tension; it forces meaningful decisions. In the status quo, the risk is ever-present; a sleep spell can ruin a 1st level party. There is no plot protection. Consequently, it is very hard to build meaningful tension. Slowly whittling away hit points; slowly whittling away spells and resources; and yes, slowly whittling away action points-- all of these give me greater control as a DM over increasing tension. I want all of these knobs and levers, and more. I view hit points as the primary ablative resource of the single encounter. (I don't mind the players healing up after every battle.)I view spells and dailies as the primary ablative resource of the game session.I view action points as the primary ablative resource of the adventure.</blockquote>I think you nailed down pretty well what I don't like about Save and Die and how to &quot;fix&quot; them. As a player I can't keep the same level of tension for the 4-8 hours of a game session. Save or Die brings me is &quot;exciting&quot;, but I come from a relaxed state to this in an incredibly sort time, and then its all over again. Ablating hit points, losing possibilities or losing action points, they can all serve the goal of creating tension over a short but not too short duration.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE="Mustrum_Ridcully, post: 4553898, member: 710"] Ah, well, I can live with that. But who cares about me? ;) For D&D, perhaps. But I mentioned Torg, and I somehow like Torgs approach more. Though it also has its drawbacks, I suppose. Possibilities are plot protection & moxie points. Damage is dealt as shock and as wounds - you just can spend your Possibilities to negate that damage. Basically it feels like it creates a "realistic" world and then adds the plot protection on. Maybe this is actually too complicated or to convoluted? Or maybe this is just brilliant for any fan of "realismn" or "versimilitude", because he understands "this is what would happen in the real world, but we don't let it happen!" While hit points confuse and conceal the issue. EDIT: I had meant to mention this and forgot. I [I]like [/I]the fact that there are effects-- poison, save or die-- that can kill you "suddenly." But that is not to say that the risk should be completely unanticipated. In terms of plot protection, it matters that the players know when they are at significant risk. It helps to build tension; it forces meaningful decisions. In the status quo, the risk is ever-present; a sleep spell can ruin a 1st level party. There is no plot protection. Consequently, it is very hard to [I]build [/I]meaningful tension. Slowly whittling away hit points; slowly whittling away spells and resources; and yes, slowly whittling away action points-- all of these give me greater control as a DM over increasing tension. I want all of these knobs and levers, and more. I view hit points as the primary ablative resource of the [I]single encounter[/I]. (I don't mind the players healing up after every battle.) I view spells and dailies as the primary ablative resource of the [I]game session[/I]. I view action points as the primary ablative resource of the [I]adventure[/I].[/QUOTE] I think you nailed down pretty well what I don't like about Save and Die and how to "fix" them. As a player I can't keep the same level of tension for the 4-8 hours of a game session. Save or Die brings me is "exciting", but I come from a relaxed state to this in an incredibly sort time, and then its all over again. Ablating hit points, losing possibilities or losing action points, they can all serve the goal of creating tension over a short but not too short duration. [/QUOTE]

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