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<blockquote data-quote="Turtlejay" data-source="post: 4930799" data-attributes="member: 70267">Your first paragraph reads to me as &quot;People who like 4e are brainwashed&quot;, which is a little offensive to me.&nbsp; I like 4e.&nbsp; I like everyone at the table having fun.&nbsp; I like everyone having moments where they contribute to the fight.&nbsp;I played a 3.5 short campaign where I was a gnomish conjuror (specialist wizard).&nbsp; After the first session I changed PC's.&nbsp; I didn't like that a few rounds in I had three dire lions dominating the battlefield, and my turn took two or three minutes.&nbsp; I was self conscious that my time in the spotlight was really a drag to the other players.&nbsp;Moving along, what level are you playing at?&nbsp; I find it odd that you think a wizard has HP's near a defender's.&nbsp; In our 9th level game my fighter has around 30 or so more HP than the Invoker, and twice as many surges.&nbsp; Higher HP's mean higher surge values and a deeper dip into negatives before I die.&nbsp;Wizards may have alright AC's now, but the games I have played have pretty consistently had the defenders with an AC 2-5 points higher.&nbsp; I don't think this is a valid point.&nbsp;My poor departed PC was a wizard.&nbsp; My current one (as I mentioned) is a fighter.&nbsp; Try playing that combination back to back and then typing &nbsp;I think you are being disingenuous.&nbsp; My wizard did very little damage, with his highest power being something silly like 2d8+int, but had increcible control, with debuffs and controlled movement out the wazoo.&nbsp; My fighter has at wills that do more than that daily of the wizard.&nbsp; He *marks* enemies and stays on top of them.&nbsp; His behavior in and out of combat is wholly different.&nbsp;The question about giving the other players something since you massively buffed arcane and divine casters is a valid one.&nbsp; You dismiss it, and imply that by asking it we are slaves to Wizards marketing/brainwashing complex.&nbsp; You simlutaneously claim to not be bashing 4e the *game* while suggesting that those who play it are somehow being hoodwinked into something lesser.&nbsp;Balance does not mean that every player does 1d6+5 damage in a circle until something dies.&nbsp; It means that one player cannot dominate or control every situation that comes up to the detriment of the enjoyment of everyone else.&nbsp; You misinterpret what I and others have been saying.&nbsp;Jay</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Turtlejay, post: 4930799, member: 70267"] Your first paragraph reads to me as "People who like 4e are brainwashed", which is a little offensive to me. I like 4e. I like everyone at the table having fun. I like everyone having moments where they contribute to the fight. I played a 3.5 short campaign where I was a gnomish conjuror (specialist wizard). After the first session I changed PC's. I didn't like that a few rounds in I had three dire lions dominating the battlefield, and my turn took two or three minutes. I was self conscious that my time in the spotlight was really a drag to the other players. Moving along, what level are you playing at? I find it odd that you think a wizard has HP's near a defender's. In our 9th level game my fighter has around 30 or so more HP than the Invoker, and twice as many surges. Higher HP's mean higher surge values and a deeper dip into negatives before I die. Wizards may have alright AC's now, but the games I have played have pretty consistently had the defenders with an AC 2-5 points higher. I don't think this is a valid point. My poor departed PC was a wizard. My current one (as I mentioned) is a fighter. Try playing that combination back to back and then typing I think you are being disingenuous. My wizard did very little damage, with his highest power being something silly like 2d8+int, but had increcible control, with debuffs and controlled movement out the wazoo. My fighter has at wills that do more than that daily of the wizard. He *marks* enemies and stays on top of them. His behavior in and out of combat is wholly different. The question about giving the other players something since you massively buffed arcane and divine casters is a valid one. You dismiss it, and imply that by asking it we are slaves to Wizards marketing/brainwashing complex. You simlutaneously claim to not be bashing 4e the *game* while suggesting that those who play it are somehow being hoodwinked into something lesser. Balance does not mean that every player does 1d6+5 damage in a circle until something dies. It means that one player cannot dominate or control every situation that comes up to the detriment of the enjoyment of everyone else. You misinterpret what I and others have been saying. Jay [/QUOTE]

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