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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
What do you ban? (3.5)
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<blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 5426415" data-attributes="member: 4937"><p>Because a lot of damage distributed amongst a lot of targets is alot less problimatic than a bunch of damage dealt to a single target. Fire ball and cone of cold are actually rather weak in stock 3.5. The only thing that they are really good for is cleaning out a bunch of mooks without a lot of trouble, but mooks aren't terribly dangerous to begin with. Consider that the average damage presave of a fireball is 35. Now, factor in that the target at higher levels will probably make the save and probably has some amount of energy resistance and the average damage of the fireball to something actually threatening goes down to about 7. </p><p></p><p>Just because you can do 35 damage to a 20 ogres doesn't make fireball broken. By the time you are 10th level, CR 2 or CR 3 challenges like ogres have a lot of relatively easy solutions, like Cleave for example. But being able to do 700 damage to a single target at 10th level would be broken. </p><p></p><p>Wraithstrike spikes damage up beyond the expectation for all levels that it is available. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes, but it also has alot of counters - crit immunity, immunity to mind effecting spells, freedom of movement, or even just a good will save. </p><p> </p><p></p><p></p><p>I believe that the idea is that your attack is so unhindered by the target, that you rip right through it and follow through on a different target. I'm not sure how 'realistic' this is, but its a staple of fantasy and swords movies. For example, the famous 'seven cuts' scene in Yojimbo includes at least one 'cleave' type move.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Celebrim, post: 5426415, member: 4937"] Because a lot of damage distributed amongst a lot of targets is alot less problimatic than a bunch of damage dealt to a single target. Fire ball and cone of cold are actually rather weak in stock 3.5. The only thing that they are really good for is cleaning out a bunch of mooks without a lot of trouble, but mooks aren't terribly dangerous to begin with. Consider that the average damage presave of a fireball is 35. Now, factor in that the target at higher levels will probably make the save and probably has some amount of energy resistance and the average damage of the fireball to something actually threatening goes down to about 7. Just because you can do 35 damage to a 20 ogres doesn't make fireball broken. By the time you are 10th level, CR 2 or CR 3 challenges like ogres have a lot of relatively easy solutions, like Cleave for example. But being able to do 700 damage to a single target at 10th level would be broken. Wraithstrike spikes damage up beyond the expectation for all levels that it is available. Yes, but it also has alot of counters - crit immunity, immunity to mind effecting spells, freedom of movement, or even just a good will save. I believe that the idea is that your attack is so unhindered by the target, that you rip right through it and follow through on a different target. I'm not sure how 'realistic' this is, but its a staple of fantasy and swords movies. For example, the famous 'seven cuts' scene in Yojimbo includes at least one 'cleave' type move. [/QUOTE]
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