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General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
what do you consider a "good" AC?
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<blockquote data-quote="dcollins" data-source="post: 434003" data-attributes="member: 876"><p>(1) As I warned about, and you even quoted, a common trick is to be "counting a series of extremely situation-specific modifiers into their claimed AC. "</p><p></p><p>The following would all fall under such a categorization:</p><p></p><p><em>(unnamed)/<strong>5</strong> ... "Expertise" feat, maximum benefit of +5AC/-5 to-hit</em></p><p><em>cover/<strong>7</strong> ... Potion of <em>Shield</em></em></p><p><em>dodge/<strong>10</strong> ... Duellist class ability when fighting defensively; triggered by "Expertise" entry above (see S&F).</em></p><p><em>dodge/<strong>1</strong> ... "Dodge" feat</em></p><p><em>dodge/<strong>2</strong> ... "Twin Sword Style" feat (see FRCS)</em></p><p><em>dodge/<strong>2</strong> ... "Off-Hand Parry" feat (see S&F)</em></p><p><em>... +8 more (Greater Mobility Duellist class feature, see S&F) when avoiding AoO's provoked by movement through threatened areas.</em></p><p></p><p>So that's 27 points of AC by my count that are not available when ambushed, starting combat unawares, shot from afar by an archer or rock-thrower etc., i.e., do not truly count as "base AC".</p><p></p><p></p><p>(2) The <em>potion of shield</em> is quite questionable. Many players and DMs do not believe the <em>potion of shield</em> is allowed by the potion-creation rules. It's certainly not in the table of potions, DMG p. 191. (But that's somewhat a nonissue, since it's included in #1 above.)</p><p></p><p>(3) Again, the <em>bracers of armor</em> don't stack with the enhanced buckler shield. (See discussion and reference above.) There is not, in fact, a unique "shield" bonus type. -- That would knock off 5 AC armor bonus points from your count above.</p><p></p><p>(4) You also added the buckler haste bonus together with the defender weapon in the same hand, when you cannot use both at the same time, per PH p. 105, under "buckler": "if you use a weapon in your off-hand, you don't get the buckler's AC bonus". -- That would imply you need to forego at least the 4 points from the speed buckler.</p><p></p><p>(5) Again, I'll take your word that the equipment price math works out...</p><p></p><p></p><p>So, just removing issues #1-4 above out of the calculation reduces the full-time AC of this character to: 85 - 27 - 5 - 4 = <strong>49</strong>, that is, under AC 50, pretty much like I theorized in my preceding 10/21 post.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="dcollins, post: 434003, member: 876"] (1) As I warned about, and you even quoted, a common trick is to be "counting a series of extremely situation-specific modifiers into their claimed AC. " The following would all fall under such a categorization: [i](unnamed)/[b]5[/b] ... "Expertise" feat, maximum benefit of +5AC/-5 to-hit cover/[b]7[/b] ... Potion of [i]Shield[/i] dodge/[b]10[/b] ... Duellist class ability when fighting defensively; triggered by "Expertise" entry above (see S&F). dodge/[b]1[/b] ... "Dodge" feat dodge/[b]2[/b] ... "Twin Sword Style" feat (see FRCS) dodge/[b]2[/b] ... "Off-Hand Parry" feat (see S&F) ... +8 more (Greater Mobility Duellist class feature, see S&F) when avoiding AoO's provoked by movement through threatened areas.[/i] So that's 27 points of AC by my count that are not available when ambushed, starting combat unawares, shot from afar by an archer or rock-thrower etc., i.e., do not truly count as "base AC". (2) The [i]potion of shield[/i] is quite questionable. Many players and DMs do not believe the [i]potion of shield[/i] is allowed by the potion-creation rules. It's certainly not in the table of potions, DMG p. 191. (But that's somewhat a nonissue, since it's included in #1 above.) (3) Again, the [i]bracers of armor[/i] don't stack with the enhanced buckler shield. (See discussion and reference above.) There is not, in fact, a unique "shield" bonus type. -- That would knock off 5 AC armor bonus points from your count above. (4) You also added the buckler haste bonus together with the defender weapon in the same hand, when you cannot use both at the same time, per PH p. 105, under "buckler": "if you use a weapon in your off-hand, you don't get the buckler's AC bonus". -- That would imply you need to forego at least the 4 points from the speed buckler. (5) Again, I'll take your word that the equipment price math works out... So, just removing issues #1-4 above out of the calculation reduces the full-time AC of this character to: 85 - 27 - 5 - 4 = [b]49[/b], that is, under AC 50, pretty much like I theorized in my preceding 10/21 post. [/QUOTE]
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