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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Lanefan" data-source="post: 7884775" data-attributes="member: 29398">It seems you're talking about the end driving the means here, where one selectively chooses (or invents) mechanics and tools to achieve a desired end result.  Which makes sense.But what happens if-when its the means that are seen as important, and the end result just becomes whatever happens to get out-put by the mechanics and tools used? (as an example, this is my usual approach to playing music - it's the actual creating and playing that's fun, while the end result that gets recorded might very well not be fun for anyone else!)And this same difference can be seen in D&D design.  1e was results-driven: the designers knew what they wanted something to do and just invented whatever particular mechanic was needed to do that one thing.  5e is - or certainly seems - more mechanics-driven: everything runs on d20 and advantage-disadvantage, and the results are much more left to take care of themselves.On reading this, I now think we more or less agree and are just saying much the same thing in different ways.</blockquote>