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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Bloodstone Press" data-source="post: 1491334" data-attributes="member: 12468">So, are you arguing that magic should be defined as random (non-repeatable), inexplicable (even to the practitioners of it), unverifiable, and unteachable?  That is interesting, but I don't think most magic systems in RPGs, literary fiction or even in real world mysticism work that way. Even modern day "psychics" like Sylvia Brown say their "powers" come from "God," or that they hear voices from the "spirit world."  Because you, a common person, can understand concepts like "God" and the "spirit world" doesn't change Sylvia from a psychic into a scientist does it?Why?On the other side of the coin, we could talk about all the herbal concoctions that natives have used for years to treat illnesses, calling them "magic potions." But later, scientist come along and discover that those plants have certain chemicals in them that really can help specific illnesses.  Again, I think the point is, if the average person doesn't understand the workings, it might as well be magic. Native people of South America didn't know why coca leaves seemed to boost energy and help with alertness. To them it was a magical plant. Today scientists know why that happens, so it isn't magic anymore, its science. That goes for peyote too. To the native Americans, it was a magical plant that could transport them to the spirit world (astral travel?). To scientists, it is a plant with mescaline in it. Another example, a Haitian witch doctor that creates zombies with a potion probably thinks the potion is “magical.” However, scientists can analyze the potion’s ingredients and discover the chemicals that induce temporary comas.  Note that the witch doctor and the Native American shaman both perceive themselves as a “magic users” in much the same way that a scientist sees himself as a “science user.” The witch doctor might not know about the chemical compounds and how they react with the brain, but he knows the general effect of the mixture and how to use it to control those who know less about it than he does. .</blockquote>

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