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Message: <blockquote data-quote="steeldragons" data-source="post: 5906290" data-attributes="member: 92511">Perhaps. But, I feel, in general, the tribal monsters especially and all monsters to a certain extent, do get repetitive. We [anyone who's been playing for any amount of time] have a built in knowledge or at least conception of what a kobold or a goblin or orc is like. To keep them from being repetitive, then that puts the onus on the DM to take some time and make them their own (as, I feel, it should be). The MM doesn't have to give me 3-5 different kobolds or goblins or orcs so I can be "different" with "my" masterpiece kobold/goblin/orc. The themes presented for PCs should be more than adequate to give your tribal humanoids some diversity without necessarily having to each be a special snowflake...but if you want that "extra level of complexity", the guidelines are there for you to implement (probably detailed in the DMG but I see no reason not to have some guidleines in the front or back in an appendix of the MM as well.)  If the PC "barbarian" who has the berserker theme can do XYZ, then why shouldn't an orc with the same theme? You don't have to give me a separate stat block for "Orc Berserker."I'm thinkin' something like this...I open the MM and turn to "Goblin." There, with a lovely picture, is the stat block for joe-shmoe-average goblin warrior that you are going to be encountering 8 or 9 times out of 10. The "skirmisher" Theme [just as example] is built in to the stats and detailed in the fluffy description goodness. As well as things like "tribal organization/life", size of the "average" community, how many goblins get a "captain/elite warrior", how many more have a king with/among them, etc. How they thrive on/excel at Ambushing, setting (and luring into) traps, etc...general tactics.Then in a nice, neat lil' sidebar, colored block off to the side:"To diversify your band/tribe of goblins, the following additional themes and abilities are suggested: Archer, Hunter, Spearman, Sneak Attack, or any other Skill or class ability of the Rogue class. To create a goblin shaman or witch-doctor: +X to AC; -Y to HP; Apply the shaman and or sorcerer Themes with spells appropriate for [up to] a 4th level caster; or any other Skill of the Mage or Cleric class. To create a goblin king/chieftain: +X to AC; +Y to HP; remove attack penalty for acting in daylight; any other Skill or Class ability of the Fighter class. Elite/Bodyguards of the goblin tribe: +X to AC; automatic max hit points; remove penalty for acting in daylight; add the "hunter" Theme or any Combat Maneuver [Exploit/Fighting Style/whatever they will call them] available to the Fighter Class." That sounds like more than enough. "Goblin Archer" vs. "Goblin Trap-layer" vs. "Goblin Ambusher" or "Goblin Bone-caster Rune-Wizard", etc. etc. Is not necessary.So if you want just want an average goblin [normal stat block] using a bow, no sweat. But if you want an "Archer" goblin, with whatever tricks that will entail, you can just tack it on. OR/AND for those who like going totally "off-piste" they have the door open to add in pretty much anything via theme and/or background and/or class abilities you want.The DM who wants Kobold "Wyrm Priests" or "Dragon Shields" or ranger frost-goblins who mush along sleds pulled by dire ice-toads and fight with arcebuses, having discovered gun-powder, as well as having tracking and stealth in tundra terrain, and "favored enemy" of the caribou-riding "snow elves" they vie for hunting territory with...is welcome, as s/he always has been, to do so however they like, make them the creatures they want.But the MM doesn't have to be [it simply can't possibly be] filled with multiple pages of different permutations for the same creature, generally speaking (not counting the aforementioned up thread "big categories" like giants, elementals, dragons, etc. which obviously need more than 2 pages for the various types.), simply because we live in an era of "immediate access all of the time."..at least not without a 500 page Monster Manual, which is, you must admit, rather unrealistic.If you [not any "you" here specifically, the general "you"] want the special snowflake goblins, put in the time, roll 'em up! And, hopefully, Have a ball doing it!"But I don't have the time! The book needs to do it for me." is not a valid argument. So, you don't have the time? So what? Play 'em. Tweak 'em. Play 'em again. Learn the game and it should come fairly easily. It went to easy? Make 'em tougher next time. Try 'em again. It was too hard (gods forbid a TPK!)? Make 'em weaker.And since it will be the same as using the PC themes/backgrounds, it shouldn't take too long before you know what each theme entails (or can easily access it through the PHB). Orcs might have the "berserker" theme built-in to their stat block, Kobolds, almost certainly, would have the skirmisher themes built in or perhaps a "Miner" background. Gnolls maybe get a "hunter/tracker" theme built-in?...with, then, other suggested themes or abilities in the side bar for diversification.Does this sound like a "giant leap back in usefulness"?Yes, you still might have to "tack something on", but maybe not if "savage hunter gnolls" works for you...or at the very least most of your average encounters are taken care of with the "generic/average guy" stats.The amount of work in adding a theme should be significantly less than what I've heard about 3e style monster-building...and [rather importantly to my mind for 5e] no "online monster builder" is necessary...I'm sure they'll still have/offer one, but it's not necessary. And, for those that enjoy that level of complexity/work, you could still do up individual goblins/orcs/etc., more or less, from scratch if you wanted to.But only 1 "average-joe" stat block is needed as your baseline. Not an "average" stats, "elite" stats, "solo" stats..."spell caster stats" and whatever else people think are flavorful...which, in reality, would be an endless list. Yes, we've been told "minions" [in some form/implementation] will still be in the game. That's fine...make that the baseline/average guy then.I'm rambling a bit here, I think. But...yeah...One stat block with sidebarred suggested extra themes/abilities. Should still be easily doable, and easily integrated, along with whatever fluff/description is presented within a 2 page spread. I think it sounds like a reasonable compromise and gives everyone some measure of what they prefer to work with [I think].Happy Thursday, all.--SD</blockquote>

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