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Message: <blockquote data-quote="steeldragons" data-source="post: 5906769" data-attributes="member: 92511">I likes ta thinks so...Really.Have I?! I beg your pardon, sir. I do not do "crappy adventures." <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue    :p"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" />Well, ok, not since I was in high school...and even then, complaints were few and far between. But...sure...a coupla times what I had all worked out as "this will be sooo coool" fell on deaf ears...and/or dice. Part of learning the game and what works for your group.If that's what your group wants...how'd they fall flat? Generally speaking, when the group is asking for hack n' slash, I oblige. But when we get into the third or fourth session of hack n' slash I, as DM, am just too bored...and have found, my players are generally as well...throwing in some interactions is a most welcomed change o' pace.Perhaps...and I am saying PERHAPS, in the age of a bazillion [yes, that's an actual fgure <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> ] video games, the "hack n' slash" game is more desired now than it used to be...but that's not D&D's fault nor does D&D have to become that to be the 21st century's D&D.Soooo...?...not sure what you're saying here. You want a Monster Manual that is all set up with pre-arranged encounter/adventure/lairs?Because...it is?I didn't learn to not stick my hand in the fire because someone told me everything that fire does to exposed flesh. I had someone tell me, "The fire is dangerous. Don't do that!" (prolly with a whole lot of "bad's" and "no's" thrown in.) That, symbolically, is easily done through the fluff and the presentation of stats.Someone doesn't have to tell me, "Don't put a group of 10 4hp kobolds in front of a 10th level party." But if I do anyway, I [the DM] will get burned (barring a freak streak of reeeally bad dice rolls). Lesson learned.The fact that the Monster Manual stat block tells me: "Kobolds have 4 hit points. They are encountered, on average, in these numbers. They use these weapons/their attacks do this much damage." is that, again symbolically, person who's saying "Don't put your hand in the fire [i.e. don't use these with a 10th level party]."How else does one learn than by trying, potentially failing, and trying again? You can be guided, certainly, but you will not actually KNOW until you've done it yourself.I am advocating LEARNING/KNOWING the game...not being handed a game for you to play with all of the parameters established. If that's what you want, the games are out there...that's not D&D.That's where the imagination and the creativity flourish...without stringent parameters...yeah, you might burn your hand sometimes. Lesson learned.Riiight. That is kinda what I'm saying...a Monster Manual ought not have pre-built adventures in it. That's the module's job...though with 5e being all about the "rules modules" I suppose we need to come up with some other term for "published self-contained adventures." I believe it should be in both places...as I think I said. The DMG for those DMs with the time and interest to "build" and customize their monsters above/beyond what the MM offers. And in the MM as a simple/generalized set of guidelines, "If you want to customize [beyond what is offered in the entry with generic stats and applied themes/abilities] your kobold fighters, here's how you do it."OR vice versa! Put the detailed bit in the MM and the general guidelines or an arrow pointing to the MM in the DMG. Any DM should have at their disposal, either a published, complete adventure module OR a Monster Manual of their own. The idea that the MM is "Player's book" needs to stop/go away.Of course, 9 out of 10 people I played with, DM or not, had their own...or had access to...an MM. I'd also advocate, to go along with KM's "prepackaged" monsters idea, that in the fluff of things that DO build lairs around/with other creatures, that be included in the fluff.The "kobolds are known to domesticate vermin" and "sometimes fill their traps with oozes" is a totally valid bit of fluff that belongs under the Kobold entry.The stats for the vermin (beetles, for example) and the stats for Grey Ooze ought to be listed under "B" for beetles and "O" for oozes, respectively. NOT under the kobold entry, as KM proposes.If you want to apply those bits of fluff and flavor into your game/adventure...then you are welcome to, and easily pointed toward, doing so.Same with Goblins using/riding wolves. But to get the wolves info, I need to go from "G" [goblins] to "W" [wolf]. Or "Hill giants often make pets of giant wolves." Go from "G" to "W."If I just want a pack of wolves in the wild...I just go to "W". Why do I need to know/remember/flip to the index for "Wolf, Dire...See under Goblin." How many wolves are in a pack? Are Winter Wolves listed under Goblins, also? So we're going to have dire wolves/worgs under "Goblin"...but "Winter Wolves" have their own entry? Or they're under "Giant, Frost"?The organization just BEGS headaches, anti-intuitive looking up and "extra work" to find what you want. That's all I'm sayin'.--SD</blockquote>

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