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<blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 7596946" data-attributes="member: 4937">The player is always facing the challenge, but if the player's choices alone cannot resolve the conflict without recourse to the numbers associated with the character, then it is a &quot;challenge to the character.&quot;&nbsp; Most challenges are mixed, in that the player must make choices but those choices are constrained by the fictional abilities of the character, and so most examples drawn from a game are neither pure challenge to player nor pure challenge to character, but a mixture.&nbsp; But there are certainly examples that are nearly pure one way or the other.There is still a conflict which must be resolved.&nbsp; If the choices the player can make to resolve the complex are simple and straight forward, so that they really represent no challenge at all to recognize what those choices might be, then they are not a challenge to the player.&nbsp;&nbsp; To understand this clearly, we need to simplify from the complex game world of an RPG down to something that will provide us a clearer picture.Consider that we are not playing an RPG, but reading a &quot;Choose Your Own Adventure&quot; type book - perhaps something after the mold of the &quot;Lone Wolf&quot; series.We come to the end of a page of text, and at the bottom are a selection of choices.&nbsp; For each choice, we are told we can turn to a different page.&nbsp;&nbsp; This is a challenge to the player.We come to the end of a different page of text.&nbsp;&nbsp; At the bottom it reads, &quot;Roll a D6.&nbsp; If you roll equal to or lower than your Dex score, turn to page 32.&nbsp; If you roll higher than your Dex score, turn to page 57.&quot;&nbsp;&nbsp; This is a challenge to character.&nbsp;&nbsp; Similarly, if at the bottom it read, &quot;You fight a goblin with Attack 1 and Health 4.&nbsp;&nbsp; If you win the combat, turn to page 45.&quot;, this is also a challenge to character.&nbsp;&nbsp; The player has no choices to make in either case.&nbsp;&nbsp; Whether he passes the challenge or not depends entirely on dice rolls and what is on the character sheet - which potentially he wasn't even able to choose because there was no chargen in this game.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Celebrim, post: 7596946, member: 4937"] The player is always facing the challenge, but if the player's choices alone cannot resolve the conflict without recourse to the numbers associated with the character, then it is a "challenge to the character." Most challenges are mixed, in that the player must make choices but those choices are constrained by the fictional abilities of the character, and so most examples drawn from a game are neither pure challenge to player nor pure challenge to character, but a mixture. But there are certainly examples that are nearly pure one way or the other. There is still a conflict which must be resolved. If the choices the player can make to resolve the complex are simple and straight forward, so that they really represent no challenge at all to recognize what those choices might be, then they are not a challenge to the player. To understand this clearly, we need to simplify from the complex game world of an RPG down to something that will provide us a clearer picture. Consider that we are not playing an RPG, but reading a "Choose Your Own Adventure" type book - perhaps something after the mold of the "Lone Wolf" series. We come to the end of a page of text, and at the bottom are a selection of choices. For each choice, we are told we can turn to a different page. This is a challenge to the player. We come to the end of a different page of text. At the bottom it reads, "Roll a D6. If you roll equal to or lower than your Dex score, turn to page 32. If you roll higher than your Dex score, turn to page 57." This is a challenge to character. Similarly, if at the bottom it read, "You fight a goblin with Attack 1 and Health 4. If you win the combat, turn to page 45.", this is also a challenge to character. The player has no choices to make in either case. Whether he passes the challenge or not depends entirely on dice rolls and what is on the character sheet - which potentially he wasn't even able to choose because there was no chargen in this game. [/QUOTE]

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