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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 9182463" data-attributes="member: 42582">I'm not sure which people you have in mind. But concrete proposals that I have seen in this thread involve either AD&D-esque solutions, where fighter's action economy depends on the HD/CR/Tier of the creature they are fighting; or things like [USER=63508]@Minigiant[/USER]'s recent proposal to change the creatures hp and damage while holding their product constant; or things like [USER=20323]@Quickleaf[/USER]'s proposal that (in effect) reduce the hp of creatures vs fighters of a certain level under certain conditions (eg in Quickleaf's version, when the creature gets close to zero hp).Well, in AD&D 60 hp can mean you are Conan, or a giant slug. And AC 3 can mean you are a knight in armour, or a powerful martial artist, or a wily customer with a magic ring (DEX 18, ring of protection +3). A fighter's save vs poison represents their toughness, while a cleric's represents their god's protection of them.The first two points are also true in 5e D&D. (But its saving throws are different from AD&D.)This is why, as per my post just upthread, I regard 4e D&D as the pinnacle of these Gygaxian conceptions. It puts them to maximal and effective work.If I want a RPG that doesn't have this sort of abstraction, then I play one where it is absent: in the past that was RM and RQ; today it is Burning Wheel or Prince Valiant.This isn't true. Unless the commoner is a PC; but as I posted upthread the rules of 4e are quite clear that PCs should all be of the same level.If the commoners or squire are NPCs, then they are easily accommodated. I gave an example upthread: the squad of Drow handcrossbowmen gave the PC in command of them a minor action AoE. The squire can be statted as a minion (see eg Mordenkainen's Magnificane Emporium) or as an immediate interrupt, upon being hit, to add to AC - for extra pathos, to add double to the AC but the squire dies!The rule system is very flexible in this respect.</blockquote>

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