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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Shadowedeyes" data-source="post: 8541942" data-attributes="member: 7027005">Fun is definitely subjective, for sure. And ultimately, I think this discussion is more theoretical anyway to be honest. Most cleric players probably wanted to roleplay a character devoted to the god that they, the player chose anyway. The most likely reason this sort of situation would occur seems like one of the gotcha paladin, devil's choice things you occasionally hear about a DM doing, but I think most people agree that isn't really what a DM should be doing. And frankly, it doesn't matter because if a DM is out to get his players, he will. Cut off the fighter's hand to keep them from using 2 handed weapons for example. Ultimately, my opinion on this is twofold. I know my players wouldn't have fun losing their abilities. Maybe for an encounter I could get them to play along, but any extended length of time would be frustrating for them. I also think that it works better, at least for my world, to make the base assumption be that abilities of the player classes are not so easily removed. I mentioned before, but I think the Warlock class should be a perfect fit for a Ghost Rider patiche, and for that we need him to be able to turn on Mephisto without being powerless with a snap of the finger. I also want to be able to have a evil heretical sect of Pelor trying to corrupt the church from within, because that could make for a fun campaign. That doesn't mean I won't mix it up in certain circumstances. An NPC, or even PC(if the player is down for it), who has made a pact with a specific clause that allows such a thing could make for a fun game.</blockquote>

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