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<blockquote data-quote="Sacrosanct" data-source="post: 7414423" data-attributes="member: 15700">I disagree.&nbsp; Nothing should be punished, except maybe horrible social behavior with the group, and then the punishment is always, &quot;There's the door, don't let it hit you.&quot;However someone wants to play will generally have in game consequences on their own, and there's no need to punish anyone.&nbsp; Just be an impartial referee (the definition of what a DM is from the get go), and these people who are playing poorly tend to have that work out in the game by themselves.&nbsp; Either from dice rolls because they choose horrible stats on purpose, or because their roleplaying has created scenarios where their PC's actions will have consequences.Relating to other comments on being suboptimal or subcompetent (I hate that word), I haven't seen an incompetent PC.&nbsp; I think that's pretty much impossible unless you were intentionally trying to.&nbsp; Therefore, I think this argument about not being able to contribute to be a false argument that doesn't really happen.&nbsp; Instead, I think (and have heard often) that an PC that isn't optimized or close to be optimized is considered to be incompetent when they aren't.&nbsp; And that's a player issue, not a PC issue.&nbsp; It's the same people who make the argument that anyone who isn't optimized is actively hurting the party and are bad gamers.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Sacrosanct, post: 7414423, member: 15700"] I disagree. Nothing should be [I]punished[/I], except maybe horrible social behavior with the group, and then the punishment is always, "There's the door, don't let it hit you." However someone wants to play will generally have in game consequences on their own, and there's no need to punish anyone. Just be an impartial referee (the definition of what a DM is from the get go), and these people who are playing poorly tend to have that work out in the game by themselves. Either from dice rolls because they choose horrible stats on purpose, or because their roleplaying has created scenarios where their PC's actions will have consequences. Relating to other comments on being suboptimal or subcompetent (I hate that word), I haven't seen an incompetent PC. I think that's pretty much impossible unless you were intentionally trying to. Therefore, I think this argument about not being able to contribute to be a false argument that doesn't really happen. Instead, I think (and have heard often) that an PC that isn't optimized or close to be optimized is considered to be incompetent when they aren't. And that's a player issue, not a PC issue. It's the same people who make the argument that anyone who isn't optimized is actively hurting the party and are bad gamers. [/QUOTE]

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