Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is LIVE! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
What I don't get RE: FR and High Level NPC's
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Faraer" data-source="post: 3927159" data-attributes="member: 6318"><p>The people who dismiss "The Concerns of the Mighty" are ones who've formed false impressions of the Realms from hearsay. Any kind of in-depth reading shows that that sidebar is an excellent but brief summary of a subtle, exquisitely complex, quite consistent milieu of high-level intrigue: everything in it is borne out directly in the lore.Over hundreds of these threads, I've not read one such argument that was either coherent or well informed. Perhaps even more strikingly, in every case the poster either claims this 'problem' is suffered by notional 'other people' or says how they cleverly fixed it in their campaign, usually by doing exactly what the sources suggest.</p><p></p><p>Of course, some people quite legitimately prefer settings with a thinner high-level stratum, where PCs get to be the biggest guys around more easily, but this shouldn't be confused with the utter Chinese-whispers fantasies others spread about the Realms.Unfortunately, when a world built 'as if real' is often reduced in narrowly focused sourcebooks to a 'campaign milieu in which to base adventures and characters, place dungeons, etc.', basic information like what merchant caravans are like and why <em>gates</em> aren't used for large-scale trade get shunted into novels (here, <em>Hand of Fire</em> and <em>Swords of Dragonfire</em>).Maybe in the 60s, but the published setting considers this thoroughly, assuming many counters to farscrying and translocation spells, such as wards, so that using them is often a difficult, even dangerous magical chess game (see, for instance, the section on guardianship magic in <em>Volo's Guide to All Things Magical</em>).</p><p>Who knows what the general perception is? I'm not so pessimistic as to think a view without basis in the sources is so prevalent. But yes, Wizards have failed to take basic steps to amend these canards. I'll repost this example. In the lead-up to the 2001 <em>FRCS</em>, Rich Baker wrote:But they didn't take the spotlight off Elminster. Instead, they formalized him as an 'iconic character', redesigned his look to be more active and adventurous, put him at the front of the setting book, kept his face on the Realms homepage and insisted that he introduce it over Alaundo, published two more novels and several short stories starring him and a short-story collection with him in the middle of the cover, led the promotion of an adventure with his tower exploding...</p><p></p><p>So when it's claimed that new and severe fixes are needed, when obvious and long-called-for ones weren't tried, who, in the light of this publishing history, is convinced?This being Ed Greenwood's own attitude, which he made clear through the framing devices of the original <em>Dragon</em> articles and the Old Grey Box. Wizards decided to stop using these devices, instead promoting their novel-driven official timeline, and now say some people worry about canon too much!</p><p></p><p>This is nothing more or less than the downward spiral the books department made for itself when Elminster's popularity as a sage led to his being statted in <em>Dragon</em> #110 then misused as a novel protagonist over Ed's own favoured heroes, and the popularity of the Avatar trilogy set an appetite for End of All-type extravaganzas in direct contradiction to the Realms' natural focus on local concerns, down-and-dirty intrigues, and humanist sword and sorcery adventure.The merest glance at the scale of the map shows this isn't distantly true.</p><p>In fact, Ed was reluctant to give NPC stats at all, thus the recommendation in the <em>DM's Sourcebook</em> that they be freely adjusted for the particular campaign. The levels in <em>Forgotten Realms Adventures</em> were contributed by Jeff Grubb, and most of those in the <em>Volo's Guides</em> were added in by the editors. This is just the level scale inflating as it always does, not a specifically Realms thing at all.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Faraer, post: 3927159, member: 6318"] The people who dismiss "The Concerns of the Mighty" are ones who've formed false impressions of the Realms from hearsay. Any kind of in-depth reading shows that that sidebar is an excellent but brief summary of a subtle, exquisitely complex, quite consistent milieu of high-level intrigue: everything in it is borne out directly in the lore.Over hundreds of these threads, I've not read one such argument that was either coherent or well informed. Perhaps even more strikingly, in every case the poster either claims this 'problem' is suffered by notional 'other people' or says how they cleverly fixed it in their campaign, usually by doing exactly what the sources suggest. Of course, some people quite legitimately prefer settings with a thinner high-level stratum, where PCs get to be the biggest guys around more easily, but this shouldn't be confused with the utter Chinese-whispers fantasies others spread about the Realms.Unfortunately, when a world built 'as if real' is often reduced in narrowly focused sourcebooks to a 'campaign milieu in which to base adventures and characters, place dungeons, etc.', basic information like what merchant caravans are like and why [i]gates[/i] aren't used for large-scale trade get shunted into novels (here, [i]Hand of Fire[/i] and [i]Swords of Dragonfire[/i]).Maybe in the 60s, but the published setting considers this thoroughly, assuming many counters to farscrying and translocation spells, such as wards, so that using them is often a difficult, even dangerous magical chess game (see, for instance, the section on guardianship magic in [i]Volo's Guide to All Things Magical[/i]). Who knows what the general perception is? I'm not so pessimistic as to think a view without basis in the sources is so prevalent. But yes, Wizards have failed to take basic steps to amend these canards. I'll repost this example. In the lead-up to the 2001 [i]FRCS[/i], Rich Baker wrote:But they didn't take the spotlight off Elminster. Instead, they formalized him as an 'iconic character', redesigned his look to be more active and adventurous, put him at the front of the setting book, kept his face on the Realms homepage and insisted that he introduce it over Alaundo, published two more novels and several short stories starring him and a short-story collection with him in the middle of the cover, led the promotion of an adventure with his tower exploding... So when it's claimed that new and severe fixes are needed, when obvious and long-called-for ones weren't tried, who, in the light of this publishing history, is convinced?This being Ed Greenwood's own attitude, which he made clear through the framing devices of the original [i]Dragon[/i] articles and the Old Grey Box. Wizards decided to stop using these devices, instead promoting their novel-driven official timeline, and now say some people worry about canon too much! This is nothing more or less than the downward spiral the books department made for itself when Elminster's popularity as a sage led to his being statted in [i]Dragon[/i] #110 then misused as a novel protagonist over Ed's own favoured heroes, and the popularity of the Avatar trilogy set an appetite for End of All-type extravaganzas in direct contradiction to the Realms' natural focus on local concerns, down-and-dirty intrigues, and humanist sword and sorcery adventure.The merest glance at the scale of the map shows this isn't distantly true. In fact, Ed was reluctant to give NPC stats at all, thus the recommendation in the [i]DM's Sourcebook[/i] that they be freely adjusted for the particular campaign. The levels in [i]Forgotten Realms Adventures[/i] were contributed by Jeff Grubb, and most of those in the [i]Volo's Guides[/i] were added in by the editors. This is just the level scale inflating as it always does, not a specifically Realms thing at all. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
What I don't get RE: FR and High Level NPC's
Top