Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
What (if anything) do you find "wrong" with 5E?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Quickleaf" data-source="post: 8731107" data-attributes="member: 20323"><p>5e's desire for consistent/universal design in monsters & NPCs leads to some missed opportunities.</p><p></p><p>For example, there's an entire type of monster which we might call "test/riddle givers" like sphinxes, crypt things, certain types of door monsters (grandfather plaque gargoyles), etc. Giving these kinds of monsters the same treatment as, say, an otyugh or a hobgoblin – while that might be traditionally how it has been done in D&D – doesn't actually reflect the difference in how these types of monsters are used in play. Two basic questions a GM needs answered about a "test/riddle giver" monster are (a) what is the test/riddle? and (b) what are the consequences for answering wrong? Rather than a huge stat block, it might be more helpful if the design focused on answering those two questions first and foremost, <em>and then if there's room </em>place a little stat block there.</p><p></p><p>Similarly there's another type of monster which have the False Appearance trait, maybe we can call them "false monsters", including gargoyles, mimics, awakened trees, etc. The fundamental question for these monsters is, if it can't be noticed through conventional means / Perception, what are the signs of this monster's presence? what creative ways might the players use to detect it? Generally, these monsters don't have very interesting stat blocks – rather, the most interesting part, which is the lead up to and the "horrific reveal" itself, are left almost entirely up to the GM to sort out.</p><p></p><p>Same thinking applies to the presentation of NPCs. I was listening to the Adventure Engineers series with Kelsey Dionne, and the host (forget the gentleman's name) mentioned how the NPCs in Waterdeep Dragon Heist are introduced with a mess of stat blocks and formulaic info that really doesn't help the DM portray those NPCs. That's definitely an issue I've seen in other 5e adventures – often the good info is there, but it's not streamlined or presented front and center (essentially, their writing buries the lead with NPCs).</p><p></p><p>There was a recent interview Chris Perkins gave about the Spelljammer book, and talking about the monster book, he mentioned that Murder Comets came about because of a layout need for a 1-page monster between M and N. While I love the ideas behind the monster, and don't have any criticism there, and I know that layout challenges are real, I do think the top level managerial decision that "each monster must look so-and-so and be laid out such-and-such" is... it's the old model, but it does not (and I would argue never did) reflect/support how certain monsters are actually used at the table.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Quickleaf, post: 8731107, member: 20323"] 5e's desire for consistent/universal design in monsters & NPCs leads to some missed opportunities. For example, there's an entire type of monster which we might call "test/riddle givers" like sphinxes, crypt things, certain types of door monsters (grandfather plaque gargoyles), etc. Giving these kinds of monsters the same treatment as, say, an otyugh or a hobgoblin – while that might be traditionally how it has been done in D&D – doesn't actually reflect the difference in how these types of monsters are used in play. Two basic questions a GM needs answered about a "test/riddle giver" monster are (a) what is the test/riddle? and (b) what are the consequences for answering wrong? Rather than a huge stat block, it might be more helpful if the design focused on answering those two questions first and foremost, [I]and then if there's room [/I]place a little stat block there. Similarly there's another type of monster which have the False Appearance trait, maybe we can call them "false monsters", including gargoyles, mimics, awakened trees, etc. The fundamental question for these monsters is, if it can't be noticed through conventional means / Perception, what are the signs of this monster's presence? what creative ways might the players use to detect it? Generally, these monsters don't have very interesting stat blocks – rather, the most interesting part, which is the lead up to and the "horrific reveal" itself, are left almost entirely up to the GM to sort out. Same thinking applies to the presentation of NPCs. I was listening to the Adventure Engineers series with Kelsey Dionne, and the host (forget the gentleman's name) mentioned how the NPCs in Waterdeep Dragon Heist are introduced with a mess of stat blocks and formulaic info that really doesn't help the DM portray those NPCs. That's definitely an issue I've seen in other 5e adventures – often the good info is there, but it's not streamlined or presented front and center (essentially, their writing buries the lead with NPCs). There was a recent interview Chris Perkins gave about the Spelljammer book, and talking about the monster book, he mentioned that Murder Comets came about because of a layout need for a 1-page monster between M and N. While I love the ideas behind the monster, and don't have any criticism there, and I know that layout challenges are real, I do think the top level managerial decision that "each monster must look so-and-so and be laid out such-and-such" is... it's the old model, but it does not (and I would argue never did) reflect/support how certain monsters are actually used at the table. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
What (if anything) do you find "wrong" with 5E?
Top