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<blockquote data-quote="KesselZero" data-source="post: 5836629" data-attributes="member: 6689976"><p>I completely agree, and I would actually argue that the rogue is restricted to one concept in later versions, especially 4e. The argument is basically that over the editions, rogue skills (aka thief skills) got simplified more and more until in 4e there's just one skill called &quot;Thievery.&quot; With the exception of some feats and gear, all 4e Rogues are pretty similar (though there is now the Scoundrel/Thief divide with Essentials, but that's basically just a simplification of the combat mechanics). For a player, the difference between the various archetypes you mentioned is mostly up to roleplay, and isn't really supported mechanically. What I'd like to see (here comes my opinion) is a return to a larger spread of separate thief skills (Find Traps/Disable Traps/Pick Locks/Pick Pockets/Climb/Use Rope/Disguise/Bluff/whatever) so that I can choose where I want to focus. I could make a second story man by focusing on Climb, Use Rope, and Pick Locks, or a street thief who has Pick Pockets, Bluff and Backstab (if combat and non-combat aren't kept totally separate) or a dungeon-crawler with the Trap skills and Pick Locks, etc. etc. Instead, in 4e I get a few combat options about how I want to use my Sneak Attack damage, and one Thievery skill to rule them all. That's just not the kind of thief I personally am interested in playing, plus it's pretty easy for any other class to get the Thievery skill via a Background or Feat, at which point the rogue class is only defined by its combat mechanics.</p></blockquote><p></p>

[QUOTE="KesselZero, post: 5836629, member: 6689976"] I completely agree, and I would actually argue that the rogue is restricted to one concept in later versions, especially 4e. The argument is basically that over the editions, rogue skills (aka thief skills) got simplified more and more until in 4e there's just one skill called "Thievery." With the exception of some feats and gear, all 4e Rogues are pretty similar (though there is now the Scoundrel/Thief divide with Essentials, but that's basically just a simplification of the combat mechanics). For a player, the difference between the various archetypes you mentioned is mostly up to roleplay, and isn't really supported mechanically. What I'd like to see (here comes my opinion) is a return to a larger spread of separate thief skills (Find Traps/Disable Traps/Pick Locks/Pick Pockets/Climb/Use Rope/Disguise/Bluff/whatever) so that I can choose where I want to focus. I could make a second story man by focusing on Climb, Use Rope, and Pick Locks, or a street thief who has Pick Pockets, Bluff and Backstab (if combat and non-combat aren't kept totally separate) or a dungeon-crawler with the Trap skills and Pick Locks, etc. etc. Instead, in 4e I get a few combat options about how I want to use my Sneak Attack damage, and one Thievery skill to rule them all. That's just not the kind of thief I personally am interested in playing, plus it's pretty easy for any other class to get the Thievery skill via a Background or Feat, at which point the rogue class is only defined by its combat mechanics. [/QUOTE]

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