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Message: <blockquote data-quote="M_Natas" data-source="post: 8963252" data-attributes="member: 7025918">But then the action is not described.The problem is not, that the DM described the action in combat (or the players) but that the description of the taken action in social encounters coincides with the action declaration, because usually that is the same, especially if the players speak in Character.The describing of the action itself wither by DM or player is not a problem.That is the "problem", because it reverses what the DM does in the rest of the Game.Usually you have fixed DCs (AC, Trap DC, unlocking door DCs, finding hidden door DCs) and the players declare an action that needs a roll against a DC to adjudicate.In social interactions, the players are saying and doing stuff that should change the DC. Suddenly the DC is dynamic. And not only dynamic by a certain set of rules (like, if you fail to to roll 10 or higher the DC increases by 1 for crossing that bridge), but subjective. Is the argument the Player character makes convincing enough so that the DM decides that he will lower the DC?The DMG gives a little bit of guidance on that, but it is different from every other mode of play in the game in that regard and it is hard and can be regarded as unfair.But also the pushback to set DCs and a fixed system like it was proposed with the influence action in OneDND is understandable, because it would kill the dynamic of the system.‐---------------So, my social system is pretty RAW. It doesn't need extra rules. It just gives the whole thing a little structure. It goes as follows:My simple NPC interaction, like shop keepers and stuff, If the players want to do something or are doing something that has an uncertain outcome, there is one roll. Like haggling for prices. That's usally one roll. The DC is determined by how popular the PCs are with that shopkeeper based on their "fame" within the community, previous interactions, how they look, perform and so on and also by how they approach the situation. Also the wants and needs of the NPC play a part. I just do all that in the fly in my head to determine an appropriate DC.Then they PCs roll their charisma check (+ appropriate skill). If the meet the DC, the will get a 5% discount. If the successful by 5 or more a 10% discount. If the fail, no discount, if they fail by more than five, the prices go up 10% and Amy further interaction will have a higher DC.There is no reroll, unless the PCs change anything about the situation, like if they change their approach from persuasion to intimidation. But they can't just all reroll their persuasion attempts.With more important NPCs / more complex situations, the approach is similiar, but their could be more rolls, depending on the situation and the approach the players take.Let's say they want to recruit and NPC ad a spy.They could just go to that NPC, offer him money and a veiled threat and that will be one roll.Or they could try to befreiend the NPC first by "randomly " meeting him at a tavern, giving him drinks, helping him with a problem, collecting incriminating evidence against him and so on, which all warrants more rolls.And the DC is determined this way: 1. How hard it is, what the characters are asking the NPC to do? That sets a base DC. For simple one off NPCs, that's usally enough. No roll required (0), 5, 10, 15, 20 ... 2. The attitude of the NPC towards the PCs which will adjust the DC by a certain number (from -10 (very friendly, just saved their lives and their whole famliy and brought a pie, too!) to 0 (indifferent) to +10 or even more (outright hostile like the PCs just killed the NPCs dog in front of him or something)). That could mean, that in a city, we're everybody hates the PCs, even asking for the way (usually no roll) could lead to a roll, because they would need to convince somebody to talk to them first.3.the approach the PCs take (what are they saying? Are they bribing the guard? Did they bring an appropriate gift for the queen that is to her taste?) Which can influence the DC further.</blockquote>

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