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Message: <blockquote data-quote="GMforPowergamers" data-source="post: 8622804" data-attributes="member: 67338">I feel balance should be A goal...maybe not the main one.as for what I mean... well that is complex because I mean 3 different things when I say balance (and you can perfectly balance on one and mess up the other two)1) Balance of Player Vs Nonplayer (not player vs dm). I want a system that has in place a system where I can at a glance see if a monster or npc is a good challenge to my party.  (I think 5e falls down hard here...okay maybe jjust D&D in general).    so if an average group of 5 PCs run into a dragon today and a hoard of undead tomorrow and 2 hobgoblin archers and 2 shadows the day after that and they are all worth the same XP, they should all be close to the same challenge.2) Balance of options. When a Player sits to make a character there should NEVER be trap options. there can be slightly better slightly worse, but in general the system should go out of it's way to not make 1 set of choices much better then another.   so if I sit down and make a fighter with a 16 str, a long sword a 13 dex and 15 con with a breast plate, I should have as much fun as if I made a hexblade with a 16 cha 15 dex 13 con.3) Balance PC vs PC. this is kind of related to both 1 and 2. but if 2 players sit down to my table and both make fighters, I don't expect 1 to have an AC 23 100hp, have +13 to hit for an avarage of 30 damage per hit and the guy next to him to have an AC 15 69hp, have +10 to hit for an average of 8 damage per hit...for all the talk of 4e being the most balanced (and I love me some 4e) it also has the best example I have of IN PLAY Pc vs PC unbalancing...  we had 2 martial strikers (a teifling rogue and an elf ranger) we were somewhere near the begining of paragon, and everyone knew the ranger was throwing more damage than the rouge but we didn't have numbers... until the round from heck.the rogue crit on his daily attack... he did so much damage everyone cheered we knew it was the most we had seen him do (he even got up and did a little dance) it was in the low 120s (i want to say 122)... in the same round 1 or 2 inititives later the ranger used an encounter multi attack power and got 1 crit and 2 hits... his total was int the 130s and got mad... it was too low of damage. That momwnr blew us away.... we knew he was more optimized and doing more damage... but for 1 striker to get the highest on a daily and another to do more with an encounter and being mad about it being low made us ask the Ranger to respek)edit: to add another example... if I take a preset dungeon, it should challange all parties roughly the same (luck and player skill of course mean some fluxution... a night where the DM dropped 5 20's willl look diffrent than one with 5 1s) however if I have a fighter a rogue a paliden and a sorcerer go through and it is hard almost TPK then run 2 druids a warlock and a wizard through it and it is a cake walk that ALSO shows inbalance</blockquote>

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