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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 752523" data-attributes="member: 4937">Greybar: The reason it is the default method in savage species is it assumes that for the most part, abilities do not become _more_ important with increasing level and quite the contrary actually become less important - for instance the +1 natural armor bonus. This is all well and good for most monsters, but the problem I have with both the Half-Fiend and Half-Celestial templates is the _full_ energy immunities (not merely resistance) actually become more powerful at higher levels than low ones, and the spell like abilities follow a progression that causes them to increasingly contribute to the power of the character with time (like any other spell progression).  I don't think you can just therefore write off such abilities the way you might scent, natural armor, natural attacks, or even fly as not being a particular contribution at high levels.   Rather, the situation is more like that mentioned for SR dependent on character level in that power will tend to remain useful (and arguably more useful) with increasing level and thus cannot be discounted.Elder-Basilisk: Maybe I am overstating my case, but the reason that I think it is important to look at the template in the worst case is in practice _I think that is the only time it is going to be taken_.  I think most of the time a player is going to want to play a half-celestial, he is going to be thinking of taking Fighter or Paladin and he is principally going to be considering the template if he doesn't have to play it from first level.   I mean, if you are starting at 1st level clear half-celestial is right out of the picture whether it is +3 ECL or +5.</blockquote>

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