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Message: <blockquote data-quote="JAMUMU" data-source="post: 8931816" data-attributes="member: 7035709">I'm only really interested as D&D+ as fantasy, so I'll limit myself to talking about that. AiME and Beowulf do some interesting things in the design space, but the problem I have is - as you say - wading through all the 3pp stuff to find snatches of useable homebrew to pad out the experience. And a lot of the time the subsystems are either forcing the d20 into shapes it was not meant to hold, or go so far outside the base mechanics of D&D that it might as well be a different game. Twisting and wrestling the one game to try and produce this range of experiences is - to me, at least - like saying you can just use your $500 golf club to play a game of pool. Technically possible, but not that enjoyable. Not when there are other singular games that provide all (or at least most) of the things I want out of a game.</blockquote>