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<blockquote data-quote="Pielorinho" data-source="post: 72252" data-attributes="member: 259">Again comparing the vampire to the flesh golem:The vampire is immune to 2 of the four weapons available to first level PCs:&nbsp; weapons and turning (unless you can reliably score 22+ on your turning rolls:&nbsp; vampires turn as if they had 4 more HD than they have).&nbsp; True, it's not immune to fire or spells (except for cold and electrical spells and mind-affecting spells), but it has fast-healing 5, which the flesh golem doesn't have.&nbsp; Couple that with damage reduction, and a vampire brb1 could live a long time. Heck, so could a vampire Clr1, who would also be CR3 and could cast protection from good and cause light wounds and other fun spells on itself.&nbsp; And the flesh golem can hit twice/rnd, but the vampire can autokill with each hit.&nbsp; And the flesh golem can't do anything in combat besides hit its enemies, whereas the vampire has all sorts of funky powers.&nbsp; Would you really rather fight the flesh golem than fight the vampire?And the bear has vulnerabilities, sure -- but it also has hugely more HP than the flesh golem, can move faster, can run, can fight intelligently, and can dish out way, way more damage (3 hits at 13 HP each/rnd, as opposed to two hits/rnd at the 7 hp each).I suspect, KD, that you taught your players that plans that look foolproof according to the rules (but not necessarily from a PC's perspective) are metagaming plans, and that seat-of-your-pants houserules are necessary to keep such plans from working all the time.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Pielorinho, post: 72252, member: 259"] Again comparing the vampire to the flesh golem: The vampire is immune to 2 of the four weapons available to first level PCs: weapons and turning (unless you can reliably score 22+ on your turning rolls: vampires turn as if they had 4 more HD than they have). True, it's not immune to fire or spells (except for cold and electrical spells and mind-affecting spells), but it has fast-healing 5, which the flesh golem doesn't have. Couple that with damage reduction, and a vampire brb1 could live a long time. Heck, so could a vampire Clr1, who would also be CR3 and could cast protection from good and cause light wounds and other fun spells on itself. And the flesh golem can hit twice/rnd, but the vampire can autokill with each hit. And the flesh golem can't do anything in combat besides hit its enemies, whereas the vampire has all sorts of funky powers. Would you really rather fight the flesh golem than fight the vampire? And the bear has vulnerabilities, sure -- but it also has hugely more HP than the flesh golem, can move faster, can run, can fight intelligently, and can dish out way, way more damage (3 hits at 13 HP each/rnd, as opposed to two hits/rnd at the 7 hp each). I suspect, KD, that you taught your players that plans that look foolproof according to the rules (but not necessarily from a PC's perspective) are metagaming plans, and that seat-of-your-pants houserules are necessary to keep such plans from working all the time. [/QUOTE]

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