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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Voadam" data-source="post: 4432631" data-attributes="member: 2209">I don't think that's the issue. I think it is a spellcaster versus martial class divide for whether combos multiclass effectively out of the box.Multiclass conceptsSpellcasting:Concept 1: Gandalf/Elric/Dilvish the Damned type. A wizard who is good with a sword. Gandalf is not as good as Aragorn or Legolas or Gimli in combat, but he can hold his own plus do neat wizard things. Wizard/Fighter or Fighter/WizardConcept 2: inborn magic who then learns to master his magic. Sorcerer/Wizard.Concept 3: wizard devoted to the god of magic. Wizard/cleric.Concept 4: nature priest. Cleric/Druid.Martial:Concept 5: Young Conan a barbarian who becomes a thief. Barbarian/Rogue.Concept 6: Ninja! Rogue/MonkConcept 7: Warrior becomes the chosen one Fighter/PaladinConcept 8: lightly armored wilderness warrior. Ranger/barbarianConcept 9: Dirty tricks sneaky fighter Rogue/fighterPretty much any full caster has to multiclass very carefully to work well as a multiclass (concepts 1-4).Pretty much any martial class multiclasses fairly well with others (5-9).Take an unfocused scattershot martial character build, say start with barbarian and add on random compatible martial classes.Barbarian 2, Rogue 2, Fighter 2, Ranger 2, Swashbuckler 2, Scout 2 and he's not bad at facing level appropriate combat challenges a 12th level party is expected to face. Throw in fractional BAB and saves and he's roughly comparable to any other level 12 martial characters.12 levels of any spellcasting multiclass has to be carefully handled to take on the same type of combat foes.These are not wierd corner cases but a breakdown of the design goal when applied to multiclass spellcasters. There are options to come closer to the design goal.</blockquote>

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