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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Oofta" data-source="post: 9080250" data-attributes="member: 6801845">So if we say that the player alters [fictional] reality in non-D&D games it's a falsehood.  But then when a character in D&D doesn't have control outside of what their PC says or does, they have little agency.  Yet other games do have agency.  But how can they have more agency if the player can't alter the fictional reality in a way that the D&D PC cannot?  Then you also insist that the GM controls the world outside of the characters just like D&D.You don't see the inherent contradiction here?  Either the player can alter the fictional reality outside of what their character does or they cannot.  I'm not saying either is right or wrong and I don't think either is inherently better.  I completely disagree with you on players in D&D having little agency, but that's a different issue.</blockquote>