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Message: <blockquote data-quote="EzekielRaiden" data-source="post: 9080569" data-attributes="member: 6790260">Nope!They don't even have them in the first place. Which is what I've said. Repeatedly. They don't permit doing such a thing at all.Because there is no forced acceptance at all. You are complaining about a problem that does not occur.Like, here, let me give you an example of a completely fictitious Spout Lore that could occur in my home DW game. I have two active players right now (and three in various stages of IRL issues that prevent them from playing, sadly.)[SPOILER="Long example attempting to capture how my players actually speak/play"]Ayser: "Zeke, you said Shamil knew my parents before my mother disappeared. Right?"Me: "Yes, that's correct. Your parents met while your dad and Shamil were on campaign in the south, near the Elf Forests."Ayser: "And that was during the old Sultan's reign. The Sultana's dad."Me: "Yep. Sultan Iskandar was well-known for his skill as a battlefield commander in his youth."Ayser: "Given that's the best lead I've gotten on my mother in months...which campaign was that?"Me: "Good question. You have a rough idea of when the timing was, but you'll need to narrow it down to be more specific. How do you intend to do that?"Ayser: "Well, we just went to a library with lots of newspaper type stuff. Wouldn't they have people talking about a campaign so far south?"Me: "Absolutely! You consult with Misfar, and he has plenty of material for you to work with. Sounds like a Spout Lore roll to me!"Ayser: "That's +INT, right? And I would get my War Knowledge?"Me: "Yep. Should be +4."Ayser: "Alright." [Uses roller bot.] "Hmm. That's a 9. Taj, any help?"Taj: "Sure! This ain't my first library rodeo. (What an image!) Ayser is more used to battle stories told from academic historians and generals, not the civilian angle, right?"Ayser: "I believe so."Taj: "We'll want to check obituaries and scandal rags, the former for soldiers who...er, took the low road home, the latter for spouses that got caught with their hands in the cookie jar."Me: "Sounds reasonable to me, and we already know they have a good selection of gossip media and such from the previous visit. Give me that Aid roll."Taj: "12! Nice."Me: "Alrighty Ayser, that's enough to get you 10. At first it's hard to solidly nail things down, but with Taj helpfully pointing you to the gossip sections you had originally overlooked, you get a solid idea from a sordid affair between a young woman and the husband of one of Al-Rakkah's generals. Sultan Iskandar waged three major campaigns in the south during his reign, and it was definitely the third of those campaigns where your parents met. You even have a good idea of roughly where your mother first appeared, because that campaign was mostly closer to Al-Tusyoun, but fought one battle on the outskirts of a large village about fifty miles north of the Elf Forests. If you're going to find out anything about her origins, that is where you want to look."[/SPOILER]This (made-up example) occurred at the player's prompting. He used knowledge already held (a recent clue from an NPC), and sought out advantageous information. He made his case, did the research, and came up just a hair shy of full success; he asked his co-player for help, and said co-player gave good reasons for both why and how that PC could help, and got a good roll. I then followed the rules of the move in question: I gave Ayser an answer that was both interesting and useful. At no point did the player "change" the world. And, in this case, there is no need for me to ask how the player acquired this information. We already know that; it was from consulting this library. I suppose I could have asked where he learned about Al-Rakkah's military history, but since he is an active, commissioned officer of the Sultana's army, that's not really mysterious either. For something more obscure, like identifying an ancient magic weapon, then it would be perfectly within my rights to ask where he learned such information, and that would be purely a personal revelation, not this badwrong "changing the world" people get all twisted upon.The key point here is, nobody has a trump card. Nobody can just shut down the conversation of play. Instead, we go back and forth, working out what makes sense from the context of play. We continue having the conversation until it becomes clear that an uncertain outcome must be resolved before we can continue conversing, and that is both trigger and requirement for making a move, Spout Lore in this case. We execute that move as it is written, with both player and GM equal in needing to follow the rules of that move, and once we do, we can proceed to the next part of the conversation (which will presumably involve either more focused fact-finding somewhere else, or preparations for an overland journey to the sites of battle for that campaign.)</blockquote>

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