NOW LIVE! Today's the day you meet your new best friend. You don’t have to leave Wolfy behind... In 'Pets & Sidekicks' your companions level up with you!

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Message: <blockquote data-quote="hawkeyefan" data-source="post: 9086101" data-attributes="member: 6785785">I don't care about the quotes from the book. I'm not telling you you can't play 5e that way. Go right ahead. No one has said players should create or enforce their own rules or always get their own way. It's not that they'd automatically know about it. It's that if it had anything to do with them, they most likely would. If this was all coming about because of their actions rather than just some outside thing the DM introduced. Players who have agency tend to drive the game more... there's less need for DM plots to be dropped on them. No, I really don't. I'm playing in a 5e game now. It has even less agency than I'd typically expect from 5e. I'm a little surprised, but I'm still playing and having fun, even if it's not what I'd choose.I'm simply able to be honest about what D&D does and how it works and its level of agency. What rule are you citing that allows this? Remember, we're talking about something allowed by a specific ability, not players just randomly trying to weasel past obstacles. And I didn't say the point is to deny agency. That's just what happens. The point appears to be to maintain the DM's ideas about the game world. I gave an actual play example that wasn't ridiculous in any way. I prompted the player to tell me. The player is a creative guy, and he responded to the challenge and came up with an idea. And the result was something none of us had foreseen. The game went off in a new direction because of his ideas. Also, you're now starting to veer into value judgments, which seems unnecessary. But you said that requests may not work due to things the players didn't know. Like the no-healing god thing... give an actual example along those lines. I can't believe that this has never come up in your games, or else why would you be so adamant about it. Yes, exactly. Give an example of that. Why are the players being sent to a different universe? Did they just get zapped there because the DM decided that's what happened? Or did this happen as a result of play? It absolutely is inherent in yes or no.</blockquote>

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