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Message: <blockquote data-quote="EzekielRaiden" data-source="post: 9103907" data-attributes="member: 6790260">Okay. No one was asking you to like it. Genuinely nobody.But several people--IIRC, you among them, though with over 160 pages at this point, I'm not going to go combing back through it--explicitly said that there wasn't any difference in agency at all, or even that "trad" games have more agency.If you're willing to grant what you've said here, I don't really think there's much more to talk about. You recognize that a distinct thing is present, and that in being present, all else being equal, it implies there is more agency in one thing than the other. You don't consider that particularly valuable, so it isn't for you. No one has told you it is or should be.....I do.What is with this aggressive "how dare you yuck my yum" attitude? You guys are the ones who were saying that our yum was yucky! That there wasn't any difference in agency, or that if one did exist, it was in favor of "trad" gaming.Okay.Character agency is like a nice little electric hybrid. It gets you where you want to go, has good gas mileage, maybe it has some quirks or limitations but most of those are not particularly onerous if you're prepared.Player agency is like a completely different kind of car. Say, a genuine off-road SUV (not the urbanized trash vehicles masquerading as "SUVs" today). It doesn't get anywhere near as good gas mileage, so you shouldn't drive it around town, but if you like to go hunting, or camping, or carrying large quantities of material from one place to another, or something of that nature, it can deliver in ways the hybrid simply cannot do.It is possible for agency to be a binary...and yet still something where you can have more or less of it, if it can come in multiple flavors. Which is what Raiztt and now Mamba have granted to be true. Of course, I don't actually agree that agency is a binary and you certainly haven't proven that it is one, but even if that's true, the possibility of different kinds of agency--different levels on which one can make choices that affect the environment, to use your definition--means that you can have more "yep, that's agency" answers in one game than in another.</blockquote>

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