Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
What is player agency to you?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 9109329" data-attributes="member: 82106"><p>You're asserting that I said things I never said. Believe me, I could go chapter and verse with you on the mathematical aspect of complexity, and I never ever in a billion years stated that Chess is more complex than Go, nor consequently given some sort of explanation of it as you are imputing. In fact I'm pretty sure, without dredging back through every post I have made in the past 2 days, that I stated that Go is more complex than Chess. At the very least I said something about them both being in a more complex category than certain other games (Checkers being one IIRC). Whatever horse you are beating, it isn't even in this race! </p><p></p><p>However, I disagree with you as to what we look at when we refer to complexity. We look at the totality of possibilities when discussing board games, and then maybe in more detail at how different positions can be represented in slightly more abstract ways (IE Go contains a large number of what are recognized by analysts as functionally equivalent situations which all resolve down to the same sort of outcome if played through). When discussing RPGs, which are 'open games' (in all non-trivial cases certainly) the criteria must be more in terms of 'rules complexity' as there is no enumerable set of board positions to compare. </p><p></p><p>Etc. I can hash all this out as much as you want, and write you a book on game theory and complexity theory if you want, but the point stands, whatever you are imputing to me as simplistic wrong-headed answers, I am not giving them!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="AbdulAlhazred, post: 9109329, member: 82106"] You're asserting that I said things I never said. Believe me, I could go chapter and verse with you on the mathematical aspect of complexity, and I never ever in a billion years stated that Chess is more complex than Go, nor consequently given some sort of explanation of it as you are imputing. In fact I'm pretty sure, without dredging back through every post I have made in the past 2 days, that I stated that Go is more complex than Chess. At the very least I said something about them both being in a more complex category than certain other games (Checkers being one IIRC). Whatever horse you are beating, it isn't even in this race! However, I disagree with you as to what we look at when we refer to complexity. We look at the totality of possibilities when discussing board games, and then maybe in more detail at how different positions can be represented in slightly more abstract ways (IE Go contains a large number of what are recognized by analysts as functionally equivalent situations which all resolve down to the same sort of outcome if played through). When discussing RPGs, which are 'open games' (in all non-trivial cases certainly) the criteria must be more in terms of 'rules complexity' as there is no enumerable set of board positions to compare. Etc. I can hash all this out as much as you want, and write you a book on game theory and complexity theory if you want, but the point stands, whatever you are imputing to me as simplistic wrong-headed answers, I am not giving them! [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
What is player agency to you?
Top