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What is player agency to you?
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<blockquote data-quote="hawkeyefan" data-source="post: 9119468" data-attributes="member: 6785785"><p>Perhaps what you say here implies you may be missing things about the games others have mentioned? </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Well, based on other “statistics” you’ve shared, you’ll excuse me if I don’t lend your anecdotes too much weight. </p><p></p><p>Having said that, I’m sure I’ve played in casual games based on how you’ve described them above. However, I don’t see any relation at all to the casualness of a game and the amount of prep the GM puts in. </p><p></p><p>In fact, the more prep a GM puts into the game, the more casual it’s likely to be for me as a player. How could it not be so? </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Right. I don’t think this reflects upon how casual their game may be, though. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>“Vague”? The processes aren’t vague. I offered you an example, and plenty of others have been offered. You haven’t seemed to grasp them, so I’m not gonna try and explain them in detail. </p><p></p><p>Rest assured though, there are many games with such processes and rules that are more tightly designed than D&D. </p><p></p><p>As for your imagination, maybe not all your players are interested in that being the totality of play?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The GM may or may not make the random encounter table. Many games offer predetermined tables by adventure or terrain type or season or so forth. </p><p></p><p>And also, no game works as you keep describing with these absurd examples. No one wishes for a goblin with lots of gold. Context matters. The rules matter. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>But the example you go on to provide is exactly that. The players wanted to reclaim a dwarven hold. And then you provided that opportunity.</p><p></p><p>This feels inconsistent. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Only because you’re either missing or ignoring the point. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Because the examples you provide are absurd. You ignore the examples offered by other folks, sub in your own absurd examples that display a clear lack of understanding, and then criticize your own absurd examples. </p><p></p><p></p><p>So they came up with an idea for a quest and then you made that quest central to play? That sounds like the players having a say, no? Do you think they gamed you? Or that you just handed them what they wanted? Or that you’re a casual buddy good time GM with a backwards hat or whatever? </p><p></p><p>It’s hard to examine your example because I feel like the little bit where you said “Then gave it to me to make all the real details” is likely covering quite a bit of territory. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Right… you value your prep over player contribution. Perfectly fine preference. There are other ways to do it, though, which involve the players in a more active way. Doesn’t make them casual or whatever other label you want to apply. Just different, and more concerned with collaboration.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="hawkeyefan, post: 9119468, member: 6785785"] Perhaps what you say here implies you may be missing things about the games others have mentioned? Well, based on other “statistics” you’ve shared, you’ll excuse me if I don’t lend your anecdotes too much weight. Having said that, I’m sure I’ve played in casual games based on how you’ve described them above. However, I don’t see any relation at all to the casualness of a game and the amount of prep the GM puts in. In fact, the more prep a GM puts into the game, the more casual it’s likely to be for me as a player. How could it not be so? Right. I don’t think this reflects upon how casual their game may be, though. “Vague”? The processes aren’t vague. I offered you an example, and plenty of others have been offered. You haven’t seemed to grasp them, so I’m not gonna try and explain them in detail. Rest assured though, there are many games with such processes and rules that are more tightly designed than D&D. As for your imagination, maybe not all your players are interested in that being the totality of play? The GM may or may not make the random encounter table. Many games offer predetermined tables by adventure or terrain type or season or so forth. And also, no game works as you keep describing with these absurd examples. No one wishes for a goblin with lots of gold. Context matters. The rules matter. But the example you go on to provide is exactly that. The players wanted to reclaim a dwarven hold. And then you provided that opportunity. This feels inconsistent. Only because you’re either missing or ignoring the point. Because the examples you provide are absurd. You ignore the examples offered by other folks, sub in your own absurd examples that display a clear lack of understanding, and then criticize your own absurd examples. So they came up with an idea for a quest and then you made that quest central to play? That sounds like the players having a say, no? Do you think they gamed you? Or that you just handed them what they wanted? Or that you’re a casual buddy good time GM with a backwards hat or whatever? It’s hard to examine your example because I feel like the little bit where you said “Then gave it to me to make all the real details” is likely covering quite a bit of territory. Right… you value your prep over player contribution. Perfectly fine preference. There are other ways to do it, though, which involve the players in a more active way. Doesn’t make them casual or whatever other label you want to apply. Just different, and more concerned with collaboration. [/QUOTE]
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