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<blockquote data-quote="RenleyRenfield" data-source="post: 9852946" data-attributes="member: 7044197">I feel like [USER=205]@TwoSix[/USER]&nbsp; really captured what I&nbsp; know&nbsp; my players would have also said.&nbsp; Word for word, this is perfect ^1)&nbsp; Compared to grand theft auto style &quot;you are in a city what do you do?&quot;&nbsp; Yeah, your scenario was &quot;on rails&quot;. They MUST face this situation, therefore they are &quot;on the plot train&quot;.&nbsp;&nbsp; Was there options for how to resolve?&nbsp; sure, but was it ANY option? such as just walking away? No.&nbsp;&nbsp; So they were forced into a situation.2) I think that ttrpg is getting old enough and diverse enough that terms we used in the 90s may not have as much clarity.&nbsp; Video games have brought extra play options and expectations into the table, so that can shift what words mean to any given person.&nbsp; Try running 2eAD&amp;D Demonweb Pits for a group of 15 years olds and again for 65 years olds = will be a different approaches and concerns for sure.... IMHO...I personally have enough diversity in games and plots that &quot;sandbox&quot; is closer to Grand Theft Auto, where you just... do whatever, the GM comes to the table with 0 plots or scenarios.&nbsp; And then as players poke at things, they generate drama, problems, and plots evolve from that.&nbsp; And at any time they can abandon a plot or blow it up.&nbsp; I may not have called this 'sandbox' in 1992...I personally think that Railroad games are good, great even.&nbsp; A railroad game to me is largely the scenario that [USER=467]@Reynard[/USER]&nbsp; described.&nbsp; Choices are limited, characters are 'stuck in', and by and large we are playing to see how this specific scenario resolves. But, I love that, as a player and a GM.&nbsp; As long as I am aware of it, playing to see how well I can accomplish a scenario is fun!&nbsp; And players I run games for love it too, works great for Star Wars canon plots too.&nbsp; We also see a lot of rail-road-ish games at rpg conventions, due to time constraints and wanting to 'finish' the plot.&nbsp; I also think there are varying degrees of either. &nbsp; I have been on so few games where there we no right choices except for the single specific ones, and those were fun.&nbsp; Usually a Cthulhu style game, short, punchy and deadly.&nbsp;&nbsp; But I have been on Vampire games where the players did whatever they wanted, and then they made choices that &quot;locked them in&quot; to a problem they had to face, almost railroady.&nbsp; Or how TwoSix put it, &quot;At the train station&quot; for sure. I no longer think you can wave a hand and call a game any one thing.&nbsp; And that goes for a scenario.&nbsp; It can shift mid-way too.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="RenleyRenfield, post: 9852946, member: 7044197"] I feel like [USER=205]@TwoSix[/USER] really captured what I [I]know[/I] my players would have also said. Word for word, this is perfect ^ 1) Compared to grand theft auto style "you are in a city what do you do?" [B]Yeah, your scenario was "on rails". [/B] They MUST face this situation, therefore they are "on the plot train". Was there options for how to resolve? sure, but was it ANY option? such as just walking away? No. So they were forced into a situation. 2) I think that ttrpg is getting old enough and diverse enough that [B]terms we used in the 90s may not have as much clarity[/B]. Video games have brought extra play options and expectations into the table, so that can shift what words mean to any given person. Try running 2eAD&D Demonweb Pits for a group of 15 years olds and again for 65 years olds = will be a different approaches and concerns for sure.... IMHO... I personally have enough diversity in games and plots that "[B]sandbox[/B]" is closer to Grand Theft Auto, where you just... do whatever, the GM comes to the table with 0 plots or scenarios. And then as players poke at things, they generate drama, problems, and plots evolve from that. And at any time they can abandon a plot or blow it up. I may not have called this 'sandbox' in 1992... I personally think that Railroad games are good, great even. [B]A railroad game to me is largely the scenario that [USER=467]@Reynard[/USER] described[/B]. Choices are limited, characters are 'stuck in', and by and large we are playing to see how this specific scenario resolves. But, I love that, as a player and a GM. As long as I am aware of it, playing to see how well I can accomplish a scenario is fun! And players I run games for love it too, works great for Star Wars canon plots too. We also see a lot of rail-road-ish games at rpg conventions, due to time constraints and wanting to 'finish' the plot. [B]I also think there are varying degrees of either. [/B] I have been on so few games where there we no right choices except for the single specific ones, and those were fun. Usually a Cthulhu style game, short, punchy and deadly. But I have been on Vampire games where the players did whatever they wanted, and then they made choices that "locked them in" to a problem they had to face, almost railroady. Or how TwoSix put it, "At the train station" for sure. I no longer think you can wave a hand and call a game any one thing. And that goes for a scenario. It can shift mid-way too. [/QUOTE]

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