Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Ruin Explorer" data-source="post: 8855476" data-attributes="member: 18">I thought I was pretty clear I was talking about utility-type spells.For my money, they're more of a genuine problem with 5E's design than the combat performance of full casters which isn't hugely out-of-line (though I'd like to see some non-casters able to handle &quot;mop-up&quot; type situations too).The same sort of consequences other characters face for failing rolls.If they try and make a neat hole with Rock-to-Mud, maybe they cause a massive collapse and a huge amount of noise, or maybe it just totally fails to penetrate and they just turn the outer surface of the wall to mud. With spells like Etherealness you should be forced to make some kind of check to not get lost, rather than it being assumed you're 100% competent at navigating in that state.As with other characters, it'd be in the purview of the DM. Certainly the spell slot absolutely should be expended. Almost everyone else expends their utility abilities, even when they fail or are useless. It's pretty much only in-combat abilities that are, for some classes, retained on a fail, and even then it's usually actually that they can't be expended unless you succeed.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Ruin Explorer, post: 8855476, member: 18"] I thought I was pretty clear I was talking about utility-type spells. For my money, they're more of a genuine problem with 5E's design than the combat performance of full casters which isn't hugely out-of-line (though I'd like to see some non-casters able to handle "mop-up" type situations too). The same sort of consequences other characters face for failing rolls. If they try and make a neat hole with Rock-to-Mud, maybe they cause a massive collapse and a huge amount of noise, or maybe it just totally fails to penetrate and they just turn the outer surface of the wall to mud. With spells like Etherealness you should be forced to make some kind of check to not get lost, rather than it being assumed you're 100% competent at navigating in that state. As with other characters, it'd be in the purview of the DM. Certainly the spell slot absolutely should be expended. Almost everyone else expends their utility abilities, even when they fail or are useless. It's pretty much only in-combat abilities that are, for some classes, retained on a fail, and even then it's usually actually that they can't be expended unless you succeed. [/QUOTE]

Verification